Monday, July 1, 2019

Calling all Wikipedia editors

Until very recently, Wikipedia's list of UK opinion polls was immaculately inclusive - it had a separate column for each party that enjoyed a non-trivial level of support.  So the Greens, the SNP, Plaid Cymru, UKIP and Change UK were all there.  I was shocked to discover last night that the SNP and Plaid have been arbitrarily removed, with their voters instead lumped together into an "others" column.  What makes this change particularly perverse is that UKIP and Change UK still have their own columns, even though they both routinely poll significantly lower than the SNP.  To put it in perspective, the SNP's support in GB-wide polls always falls in a range between 2% and 6%, and almost always falls in a range between 3% and 5%.  By contrast, Change UK have been on either 0% or 1% in all of the last ten polls, and UKIP have only been as high as 2% once in the last ten polls.  There can be no conceivable justification for taking the SNP out if Change UK and UKIP are to be left in.  And let's face it, there'd be no conceivable justification anyway.  The SNP are the third largest party in the House of Commons and the largest party by far in one of the constituent nations of the UK.  Those facts alone should put an end to any dispute.

Now, before anyone trots out the standard response of "anyone can edit Wikipedia, so don't complain, just put it right yourself", it isn't quite as simple as that.  Someone has already attempted to reverse the edit, but within literally one minute the SNP and Plaid were removed again, with the following 'explanation' appended to the edit history -

"Please see the discussion on talk - strong consensus for removal of at least some columns, namely SNP/Plaid among most" 

So I checked the Talk page, and as I suspected, this "strong consensus" turned out to consist of an in-group of only about six or seven people, all enthusiastically agreeing with each other based on their shared Anglocentric trance that it somehow makes perfect sense to remove the SNP but to retain parties that have far less support than the SNP.  Before you look at the discussion, I should probably put a health warning on it, because it dismisses the SNP and Plaid as "regional" parties who should only ever be mentioned in the context of their own "areas" and who are "irrelevant" to the "national" picture.  Someone quite reasonably points out that similar pages for other countries manage without any great fuss to include separate columns for ten or more parties, so there's no actual need for the UK page to be artificially edited down to seven.  But that argument was shouted down on the basis that other countries have proportional representation and we don't, meaning that parties with relatively low percentage support can't hope to win seats.  Which is a bit of a circular argument, because if the requirement for inclusion is the ability to win seats, how can you possibly exclude a party whose support is so geographically concentrated that it currently holds 35 seats under first-past-the-post and looks set to win considerably more in the next general election?

The only way of getting this ridiculous decision overturned is to change the "consensus" on the Talk page.  I've made my point there already, but I'm only one voice.  So if you're a Wikipedia editor and if you feel as strongly about this as I do, I would recommend that you leave a comment there and help to break the Anglo groupthink.  If you're not familiar with commenting on Wikipedia Talk pages, you need to hit the edit button in the top right hand corner as if you were editing an article, and then simply add in your own comment in the appropriate place.  You then 'sign' your comment by adding four tildes (~~~~) at the end of it.

130 comments:

  1. They're just getting ready for the break up of the UK. Britain elects has been prepped for a while on this.

    ReplyDelete
  2. You should have a chat with Craig Murray
    https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2016/03/the-astonishing-case-of-the-doppelganger/

    ReplyDelete
  3. How ridiculous will they get?
    How low will they stoop?

    The fear is strong in the Yoons.
    Wha sae base as be a slave.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Same story with the UK Polling Report website and when I complain about it, Old Nat promptly backs the website editor.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Well, I wouldn't defend UK Polling Report on that point, and I wouldn't defend Oldnat's defence of it. But it's a private website. Wikipedia is different because it's supposed to be for everyone and it's supposed to be politically neutral.

      Delete
  5. I'd like Scotland to be independent of English polling.

    It's only shoe shiners like Ross Thomson etc that want 'Team GB' polling.

    ReplyDelete
  6. If unionists want to chip away at the union like this ('Scots can't be PM...Scot parties should be excluded from UK poll reporting...England will decide if Scots can be independent!') why the hell is anyone complaining?

    This sort of anti-Scottish racism is what's taken Yes to 49% 'tomorrow - no question asked'.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Is the DUP "irrelevant" to the "national" picture?

    ReplyDelete
  8. UK services contraction seen in manufacturing.

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-economy-pmi/uk-manufacturing-pmi-sinks-to-six-year-low-in-june-ihs-markit-idUKKCN1TW1Y4

    The PMI’s output component dropped to 47.2 from 50.3 in May, pointing to the biggest contraction since October 2012.

    Looking very likely that Q2 2019 will be an official contraction.

    With yet another crash out threat for October, Q3 may show contraction as well, meaning an official Brecession.

    ReplyDelete
  9. The contrast between the UK and EU unions is so stark when you see this.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-48818715

    Real democracy at work, with all the 27 nations having to sit into the wee small hours night after night until they all broadly come to agreement on which candidates will be put forward to the people of the EU (via their parliament) for election to the big posts.

    In the UK, England just decides what's happening. Or even just a small group of English Tories.

    Can you imagine Wales, Scotland and N. Ireland being able to veto English Boris before he even reached the final round? That's what's happened in the EU to a number of candidates for Juncker's post already.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Junkers favourite kiddy fiddling bushopJuly 2, 2019 at 9:28 AM

      Up your shamrock coated gusset with a tarry brush fresh from the driveway you conned a pensioner into getting started for £1000 and it started cracking 10 days later while you had moved on to Bedfordshire in your caravan. Top o the mirnin Father Shamymus.

      Delete
  10. Scottish Skier the present day Irish William Joyce Haw Haw man who speaks for Scotland.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 1, 2019 at 2:51 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    2. Christ on a bus, there he splutters into action again.

      Delete
    3. Whine for the nat sis causeJuly 2, 2019 at 9:30 AM

      You can get up off your knees muster ladyman. The bishops left.

      Delete
  11. This is quite ridiculous. The discussion that you called "all enthusiastically agreeing with each other based on their shared Anglocentric trance that it somehow makes perfect sense to remove the SNP but to retain parties that have far less support than the SNP" did actually have disagreement, but their arguments (as well as yours) is largely without merit. Wikipedia should rely on RSes, not the whims of random partisans who prefer canvassing over actually encouraging discussion. By canvassing, you've turned a vote that you could win into a discussion that you will always lose. Reliable sources (at least recently) do not include SNP or PC in their headline numbers of polling. As such, it makes little sense to include them in the table. However, they do include UKIP and ChUK, which is why they should be included. Further, the argument that other articles have more columns is purely OSE. Lastly, the idea that this is somehow an "Anglocentric trance" shows an incredible disrespect for your fellow human by accusing them of being unable to form different opinions from you as a result of evidence.
    Yes the SNP is the third largest party by MPs. Yes it is very popular in Scotland. But it isn't reported by RSes in public polling and is often lumped in with PC in some polls.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. First of all, what you've written is utterly incomprehensible to normal people, so if you actually care about communicating with people outside the Wikipedia bubble, you might want to give some thought to that. But if I can translate your argument for those who don't know Wiki-speak, basically it's this: because SOME - not all, but SOME - London-based pollsters summarise their results in a perverse and Anglocentric way, Wikipedia should follow suit in ALL cases. That's it. A bit thin, I have to say.

      Your whingeing about "partisan" arguments would have somewhat more credibility if the original decision hadn't been rammed through by a "strong consensus" of about six or seven people who were clearly prejudiced and who offered a number of justifications for the change that were so irrational and contradictory that they could only have been driven by that prejudice.

      As far as "canvassing" is concerned, the in-group who pushed this decision through actively called for other named editors to become involved in the discussion, presumably because they knew those people would help to artificially generate a "consensus". If you disregard the views of everyone who commented after the "canvassing" started, you'd literally be left with the proposer and about one or two other people.

      Good luck trying to disentangle which comments were and were not influenced by this blogpost, by the way. Some of the people who have spoken out against your little stunt are Wikipedia editors of very long standing (sometimes ten years or more), and I don't think they'd take kindly to your assumptions about how and why they decided to contribute to the discussion.

      Delete
    2. With Scotland leaving the UK soon, and N. Ireland too, it seems sensible for England to just focus on 'England(+Wales)' only polling.

      If it was a happy, inclusive union with a future, you can bet your bottom brexit devalued £ that what was happening in North Britainshire would be part of the 'UK' reporting mix.

      It's just, as you say, a reflection of reality, i.e. the divergence of Scotland and break up of the UK.

      Delete
    3. So why did you decide to do it? I thought Wikipedia was to inform. Surely a further breakdown to give more detail is better? If I want detailed information where do I go? That is what Wikipedia is for and people like you are censoring it in your own image.

      Delete
    4. The Wikipedia editing group must have noticed that an unlisted party ends up being 3rd largest in the House of Commons. Odd it doesn't strike them as odd.

      Delete
  12. This is the problem with the independence movement - it still deals with the media and the internet as if they are fair. We need better organisation just as socialist movement did back in the day. We need a team of people who will act - in the same way as the unionist forces - who will give up some time as a team to right the wrongs on the likes of Wiki - and even begin to use Wiki for our own purposes - perhaps even remove the Conservative party as being relevant.

    I read many of the independence blogs and some I find are, to say the least 'a bit out there' and in particular I am referencing Jason Michael McCann. However, in amongst some of the more 'out there' articles are some absolute gems. His statements about the British in Ireland always rub me up the wrong way BUT inside those articles there are some lessons to be learned from the way the British state works and similar examples can be seen in the state's approach to socialism even to this day. We have to learn that this is not just an intellectual well-mannered divorce looming, this is one partner saying "your going nowhere" and is prepared to beat the shit out of the other if it is required.

    This is not just about self-determination - there is another viewpoint and they do not like what they see and they will not countenance the loss of their property. We really have to wake up to this. I too thought independence could be achieved through amicable settlement but the mood music is anything of the sort. There is a brute out there and we haven't woken up to that yet.

    I wrote some time ago on here (and was rubbished) that the SNP must challenge political interviewers on air about their anti-independence tweets and the lies the channel puts out all the time. Confrontation is actually our only weapon against the unionist mainstream. Put them on the back-foot. Embarrass them on air. Create news.

    And that is what we have to start to do. Salmond was very good at that (and I don't mean the recent stuff). The media ignores us, lies about us and only reports against us. Small business entities have to find ways to create news, politics is no different. If they won't report what we do that is good for Scotland, then we have to create news they cannot ignore - and that's why calling out lies on TV or taking action against newspapers has to begin now with a vengeance.

    Looks like things are hotting up now. They are getting worried.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Boris as 'Minister for the union' lol.

      Shitting it.

      And with good reason. It's been a long, slow process, but as we enter the final days of the waning British empire, so we are approaching a natural majority for Scottish independence. Second to join, second last to leave.

      The young Scots in the parliament meeting the queen have never known the old Britain. For them, British identity is something largely meaningless; Holyrood has been their parliament from birth. Long gone is the post-war socialist consensus and all the nationalised industries/institutions that once put the British into Scottish hearts and minds.

      They massively back independence / Europe, and can't wait to vote for both, having never had the chance before.

      They are the future. It's an essentially unstoppable process.

      Tick tock.

      Delete
    2. Tick tock paddy not long now until we leave. And the Scottish youth perhaps are not as thick as you. Joining the EU would mean an end of an Independent Scotland.

      Delete
    3. Isn't "paddy" an insulting name for the Irish?

      At least get your insults right girl!

      Delete
    4. In the English union, Scotland has no independence what so ever.

      Delete
    5. Old GW whatever going his duster , talking his usual pish.

      Delete
    6. Robin of LocksleyJuly 2, 2019 at 8:38 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    7. Am I right in thinking wee Ireland kicked British/English ass in a war?

      Around 1921 it was I think.

      Mind you, there's loads of wee countries that have done the same, whereby becoming independent, so it's not like Ireland's special or anything.

      Brits are famous across the globe for running away. It's why they glorify retreats in popular culture.

      Delete
  13. Evidently we need a Scottish version of that Wiki - one which gives a picture of polling in all four nations both separately and together, aggregated and disaggregated. I'd do it myself if I were capable of it, but, alas, I'm not.

    Pro-Union / pro-Greater England types here in Scotland and in the rUK are undergoing a form of psychological denial right at the moment - they can feel the ground shifting under their feet, they don't like it, so they pretend it's either not happening (Swinson the other day), or it's not "important" somehow.

    That's why they dismiss the SNP and Plaid as "regional" parties (and therefore irrelevant to the mainstream) when it's really because they are parties whose supporters do not suffer from the comfortable prejudices of Little Englanders, in fact, the prejudices of everyone who assumes that the United Kingdom is one country, not four.

    My own feeling is that if we're not going to set up a Wiki page that provides better and more balanced information, then we should leave them to it. The fewer people in Englandland who know what's actually happening in the Provinces the better; it's better for us if the do NOT sit up and take notice - and I for one thing it's long past time we stopped begging plaintively to be noticed, and treated a little better.

    ReplyDelete
  14. In place of a 24x7x365 careful watch over a specific Wiki article just allow that page to drift off to be a representative of 'England'. Make a clearly definable 'Scottish' article and keep it clean and honest. Also, place warnings on English page(s) to not draw conclusions regarding Scotland from non-Scottish pages.

    All this said, I would not normally look to Wikipedia for non-biased accuracy in these matters. For early 20th century Glaciology, yes, I would trust Wiki on that.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Spanish Tapas Bar Papal inquistionJuly 2, 2019 at 9:23 AM

      The truth according to Bible Annie I suppose. Si si senior. "You sheet on my bed I keell you." Said the Latino people smuggler. What's the shortest book in the world? The encyclopedia of Spanish war heros on Hitler's side during WW2. We haven't forgotten. Don't tell the British what to do. You can't even stab a bull on your own.

      Delete
  15. Comment posted. It is ridiculous.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Turn my back to the nat si anthemJuly 3, 2019 at 10:16 PM

      So are you

      Delete
  16. Jocko Paddy version of history. There was no Reformation or Glorious Revolution. There was no Enlightenment. James the Turd won at the BOYNE. CHARLIE bonny gay type the tally idiot did not get hundreds killed at Culloden. Paddy Skier did not marry a French Tart. However Gladys Knight was brilliant in the Glesga Consort Hall tonight.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 2, 2019 at 8:39 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  17. Wikipedia was a good idea. But now it is just ignored by the majority as it can be manipulated by a minority of keeks and spoilers. Then again I might be wrong as I have not checked it out for around 5 years or more.

    ReplyDelete
  18. GWC, you really are an odious, xenophobic, little twat. A poor excuse for a human being.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I am not little. Better a poor excuse than none.

      Delete
    2. Robin of LocksleyJuly 2, 2019 at 10:32 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  19. I’m beginning to suspect the reason Mundell’s spin doctor / communications department was increased by 500% was for this very reason -anti independence propaganda

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Handbag Ladyboy from RomeJuly 2, 2019 at 9:34 AM

      Get a life. Or wait till your balls drop and get a wife. She'll sort your needs out. Oh I forgot you look aren't aloud to get married.

      Delete
  20. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. England & Wales Greens are also regional.

      Delete
    2. Wait, so are the Lib Dems and Brexit. They don't contest UK-wide either (Neither are fully registered nor fields candidates in N. Ireland).

      Delete
    3. Apologies, Scottish Skier, I was trying to remove the troll comment above yours, and I hit the delete button on your comment by mistake. I've searched for a way to reverse the deletion but there doesn't seem to be one. I'll have your comment in my email, so I'll try to add it manually later if I can find it.

      Delete
    4. Nae bother James!

      I was just saying that, like the SNP, Labour are not a UK-wide party, but a 'regional' one as they don't field candidates in some home nations (N. Ireland). In fact, as my additional comments noted, I think only the Tories are a UK-wide party. While they're consistently an utter flop, they do stand in N. Ireland.

      Maybe headline polling numbers should only show the Tory % because of this?

      Delete
    5. They do stand in NI, but not in every constituency. They're not a UK wide party either.

      Delete
  21. Boris says Westminster is 'England's parliament'.

    Seems the scot nats were right all along.

    https://twitter.com/Innealadair/status/1145423695009239042

    #thegiftthatkeepsongiving

    ReplyDelete
  22. Services crashing, manufacturing crashing, construction crashing...

    The 'brexit boom' has arrived it seems

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-economy-pmi/uk-construction-has-worst-month-in-10-years-as-brexit-bites-pmi-idUKKCN1TX0VZ

    Brexit crisis wallops UK builders, survey shows

    ...The IHS Markit/CIPS construction Purchasing Managers’ Index (PMI) plunged to 43.1, the lowest reading since April 2009 when the country was gripped by the global financial crisis and way below any forecast in a Reuters poll of economists.

    The yield on 10-year British government bonds sank to its lowest level in nearly three years as investors, already anxious about the prospect of a no-deal Brexit under the country’s next prime minister, took fright at the scale of the fall...

    ReplyDelete
  23. Quick skim of the Wiki, and my BP is up! The rules (LOL) about editors commenting are opaque, i.e. seem to be non-existent. At least if there were rules, we could go to VAR for a ruling - but then we'd lose again since we are Scotland.

    ReplyDelete
  24. https://twitter.com/Nigel_Farage/status/1146081033701470209

    @Nigel_Farage
    5h5 hours ago

    Heard some say that Brexit MEPs were “disrespectful” today.

    I’ll tell you what is disrespectful — taking the ancient nation states of the British Isles and turning them into one country with its own anthem and flag, without ever asking for permission!

    ReplyDelete
  25. Out of the fascist EU by 31 October 2019. Will the independence fascist Jocks set up a hard border on behalf of their EU masters with England and screw the Scottish economy. Note the EU have voted in their new fascist millionaires. French Gov still smashing in the heads of the working class in Paris. Greek workers now pacified by the brutal treatment by their authorities. The EU will collapse.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 3, 2019 at 9:00 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  26. German defence minister take over as head of the EU and not a tank in sight. Money and corruption a substitute.

    ReplyDelete
  27. Police have called at the home of a well known Scottish/Irish Nat si blogger called Scottish Skier. His friends had contacted the police earlier as he had not made an anti English comment for five minutes.
    Police reported they had found a limp body over a computer keyboard and not breathing. Sadly the man had been defacating insitu for a prolonged period and probably died from inhalation of featous. His last tabulation was Ennngleeeshh Bastuurds ugghhh.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 3, 2019 at 8:45 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    2. Do you drive one of those Ford Anglia Sextons, with canary-yellow paintwork?

      Delete
    3. Desperation in Unionist trolls is pretty funny.

      Delete
    4. British Exit is Our BrecitJuly 3, 2019 at 10:18 PM

      So are you.

      Delete
  28. Well done to the US soccer team for reaching the finals.

    As I'll have a yank sister in law soon, I naturally got behind them.

    ReplyDelete
  29. Internal polling obviously pointing to Yes leading already or, as we know from what's in hand, this likely being imminent.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-48848660

    ReplyDelete
  30. Indeed Skier.
    https://www.thenational.scot/news/17744172.scottish-independence-lidington-blocks-release-of-key-poll/

    ReplyDelete
  31. We've been heading for this since June 2016. It's only been staved off by the fact the UK hasn't actually left the EU. Of course as soon as we reached 'leaving day' without any deal, the economy started to plummet.

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-britain-economy-pmi/uk-economy-shrinks-as-brexit-global-worries-mount-pmi-idUKKCN1TY18J

    UK economy shrinks as Brexit, global worries mount: PMI

    Anyway the 'Great Brecession' seems to be underway in earnest.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. News of this should be enough to tip things to remain in the face of no deal in the second ref. Probably the final coffin in any chance of Brexit happening. Even the mot ardent leaver soon changes there mind when it hits them in the pocket.

      Delete
    2. Quite possibly. However, England has lost the heid it seems, so not necessarily.

      Certainly, I'd rather Scotland just became independent without it having to jump in flames from the burning brexit building.

      Brexit cancelled would probably see Scottish independence day pushed forward to the next parliament, but the natural majority predicted post 2014 has already been reached or we're damn close. Brexit isn't the cause, but part of the effect.

      70 odd years in the making, so a painfully slow process, but inexorable, just like the slow demise of the British empire with which it is so closely intertwined.

      Delete
    3. Skier has been ressurected. We will soon have a shroud named after him.

      Delete
    4. Robin of LocksleyJuly 3, 2019 at 7:34 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  32. Take a look at the Wikipedia page on the Scot council elections for 2017. It headlines that "notional" result that resulted in a decrease in SNP councillors. When in fact the opposite was true. SNP ended up with more councillors (431), up from 425 in 2012. If you look at the edit history, you can see numerous changes back and forth as various editors correct the page and then get reversed out. Wikipedia should be regarded as any other information provider; with a healthy dose of cynicism.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It's probably because the SNP gained councillors in by-elections between these two council elections.

      Delete
  33. Dem Herman Nat sis now in charge of the EU and want an EU army. Wee jockos will be marching down the cobbles in Nuremburg to the Horst Wessel with their tartan Lederhosen on. Time to practice the salute Skier.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 3, 2019 at 9:02 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    2. Duty jock NAZI with immediate reply.

      Delete
    3. Robin of LocksleyJuly 3, 2019 at 9:32 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  34. Replies
    1. Of course and yes to the UK Union

      Delete
    2. Robin of LocksleyJuly 3, 2019 at 9:32 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    3. Skier do you have time for nookie or is it a quick ham shank and back to the pad?

      Delete
    4. Tamika - my camp nameJuly 3, 2019 at 11:37 PM

      Hello, Moonbeam. You're my special kind of lady, Cordelia. I like you. A lot.

      Delete
    5. Blackford said the SNP in the Commons had the largest LGBT community. Lots of sore bums and petroleum jelly then, oops dear.

      Delete
    6. Robin of LocksleyJuly 4, 2019 at 8:07 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    7. Robin of LocksleyJuly 5, 2019 at 9:04 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  35. Wee Manny the Jew in Hiding againJuly 3, 2019 at 11:46 PM

    Ursula Von der Leyden vill defeat the British and restore the 4th Reich with the help of the Scots. Zeig Heil meine beloved Fuhrer. Dem Jocks vill be our camp guards.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 4, 2019 at 8:08 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  36. Happy Americans are anti-English day everyone.

    ReplyDelete
  37. I see BBC Jockbread online is giving the English Tories a big free 'save the union' frontpage PPB again this morning.

    Internal polling clearly has them shitting bricks.

    ReplyDelete
  38. Labour in 4th place in the latest YouGov poll. And despite the the normal comments about it 'being YouGov' this has been on the cards for a while with Labour and the Lib dems neck and neck on polling averages

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Neck and neck in Scotland I assume you mean? Aye, Lab on ~16% with Libs on ~13% in subsample averages (very close to limited full Scottish polls).

      UK-wide Labour are still on ~25%; a good 7.5 points ahead of the Libs (e.g. Britain elects running average).

      Averages suggest the major shifts we've seen are tailing off now, settling into this new '4+ way split' pattern. If so, it's unlikely the Labs will overtake Labour. Instead, the English 'Remain' vote remains badly divided and so pretty ineffective, particularly with Labour still lacking a clear policy. Of course the leave vote is just as badly split without any clear policy other than crashing out at the end of October come what may.

      Delete
  39. Yougov UK Westminster VI Scottish sample:
    45% SNP
    8% Green
    15% Con
    11% Lib
    10% Brexit
    10% Lab

    ReplyDelete
  40. Tories are worried about 'anti-Scottishness'* (as GWC would describe it) of English people breaking up the union.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48866927

    Brexit: Are Tories worried about the future of the union?

    ...But Mr Lidington said: "My worry - and it involves the Conservatives but also opinion more widely - is that the threat to the union in my view comes not just from Scottish nationalism and pressure for Irish unification - it comes from indifference among English opinion to the value of the union.

    "Sometimes I think there's too many people in England - including in my party - who assume that you can be dismissive about the contribution that Scotland or Northern Ireland makes."

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. No idea why I am unknown. I comment here as douglas clark as I do everywhere.

      Delete
    2. With a name like Douglas Clark I'd rather be unknown because it sounds like the name of a convicted deviant. You scare me.

      Delete
    3. Vonto.

      If you met me, I really wouldn't scare you.

      Delete
    4. Trying again to be identified.

      Delete
    5. Do you stand close to people in bus shelters?

      Delete
  41. Dismissive is it. Cheeky get.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Are you from Liverpool? Cheeky get?

      Delete
  42. I see Ann Widdecombe has passionately compared Scots who support independence from the UK as 'slaves rising up against their owners'.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I saw Ann Widdecombe out on the street yesterday barking at the milkman.

      Delete
    2. What would the mulk man dae if he had a choice between shaggin Knickerless or Widdecombe! Would he settle for full cream or half cream?

      Delete
    3. Robin of LocksleyJuly 4, 2019 at 10:27 PM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    4. Dolzutnarb Tel GharbJuly 4, 2019 at 10:30 PM

      GWC has 3 access areas. She likes getting visited in all 3 at the same time. She doesn't use enough disinfectant.

      Delete
    5. You have eight access areas.

      Delete
    6. Robin of LocksleyJuly 5, 2019 at 6:23 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  43. The Nat sis need to give the English the Welsh and the Ulster people the vote on a Scottish National Independent fascist state. The Nat sis would win. The EU will not subsidise Scotland.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 5, 2019 at 6:24 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    2. Erm, this happened in 2014, but rUK born residents in Scotland bottled it and voted No.

      https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/politics/independence-referendum-figures-revealed-majority-5408163

      Delete
  44. Sad that a Tory had too warn the British people that the EU is a fascist dictatorship run by millionaire elitists. That should have been said by Socialists and Scottish Nat sis, however Scottish Nat sis are on the gravy train.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Robin of LocksleyJuly 5, 2019 at 6:25 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
    2. In her first speech since being elected to Westmister, Widdecombe said Scots were slaves of the English in the UK union apparently.

      Sounds anti-English to me.

      Delete
  45. There are now complaints about canvassing as a fight back.

    Their problem is that anything over around 4% of the UK vote means the SNP would be close to taking all the seats in Scotland. Wikipedia is meant to be informative. A regional party capable of taking around 8% of the seats at Westminster might be relevant when assessing polls whos purpose is to predict that kind of thing.

    If anything there might be a bit of contempt towards their audience in fudging results like that.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. So these wikipedia folk are arguing that the SNP / Scottish indy supporters are 100% right and that Scotland should go for independence as it can't actually influence Westminster elections?

      Delete
  46. Trump is really rubbing it in about how the USA kicked British ass in their war of independence. Real 'anti-English stuff' as GWC would say.

    Not sure why the brits would want to do post brexit trade deal with the USA. Must be desperate?

    Certainly, having the USA make British laws wouldn't be proper independence.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I don't understand a word you wrote. Is that French?

      Delete
    2. You only want trade deals organised by the EU criminal Mafia.
      You EU sell out nutjobs fear a massive trade deal with the EU.

      Delete
    3. I'm not sure he was exactly rubbing it in, from what I understand he was going on about airports and the 1812 war with Canada...

      Delete
    4. Robin of LocksleyJuly 6, 2019 at 8:55 AM

      Purse.
      Cordelia and purses.

      Delete
  47. The last days of Britain are upon us.

    https://twitter.com/TheScotsman/status/1147176630843953152

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. England dispensing with democracy and attempting to rule Scotland by force would be, without question, an act of war on Scotland, with all that entails.

      Delete
    2. Any sign of a war and Paddy will evacuate Coatbridge tae Oirland as they did 1939.

      Delete
    3. Sort of like how the 'Great' (lol) British Empire turned tail and ran from a few 'paddy potato farmers' back in 1921?

      The brits always bolt it quick smart when the natives decide to put up a bit of a fight. It's why the empire's all gone and Britain glorifies running away in film etc.

      Delete
    4. Whit a laugh. The British wanted out with a deal. Collins did the deal and Catholic IRA done him in. The British if they wanted could have taken out the IRA completely as they were killing two IRA scum for every killing by the IRA. But let us not forget real Irish history when they turned Ireland into a dark perverted state run from Rome. Thank goodness for Ulster.

      Delete
    5. 'The British wanted out with a deal.'

      Too chicken just to get up and leave then?

      Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose...

      Delete
  48. Robin of LocksleyJuly 6, 2019 at 8:56 AM

    Purse.
    Cordelia and purses.

    ReplyDelete