Should Scotland be an independent country?
Yes 48%
No 52%
More details to follow eventually. I'm physically blogging this from the Davis Cup semi-final in Glasgow, so it's not straightforward...
Friday, September 16, 2016
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I think the penny is slowly dropping with No voting Scots that it is a choice of two EUs.
ReplyDeleteEngland's Union or the European Union?
Decisions decisions.
EU V's EU, like it.
DeleteI wrote about this choice some time ago https://eurofree3.wordpress.com/2016/07/16/post-brexit-unionists-you-have-a-choice-to-make-eu-or-uk/
DeleteYes, the UK is effectively just a Greater England.
DeleteThe UK union flag that accurately represents Scotland's political influence would be a big St Georges Cross with the saltire only taking up 8.3% space in the background.
Submissions to Theresa May’s child sex abuse inquiry 'accidentally' deleted
DeleteVictims of alleged child abuse who submitted testimonies to website between 14 September and 2 October deleted due to 'technical blunder'
Information provided by alleged child abuse victims to the overarching inquiry set up by Theresa May has been deleted due to a blunder, it has emerged.
Submissions sent through an online form to the inquiry between 14 September and 2 October were “instantly and permanently deleted” on Thursday before they reached staff.
The information had been sent to the “share your experience” section of the Independent Inquiry into Child Sex Abuse (IICSA) website, set up for victims and survivors wanting to share their experiences with officials working on the probe.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/oct/15/submissions-to-theresa-mays-child-sex-abuse-inquiry-accidentally-deleted
EU v EU . Brilliant!
ReplyDeleteThe real decision should be explicit. Do we want to remain in the Union or be run from Frankfurt and Berlin. Who wid have thunk the Jocks would want the Huns tae run Scotland. You Nat sis hiv lost the plot. Lossen the grip on yer todgers and think. Your hatred of the English is racist.
ReplyDeleteThe Independent @Independent
DeleteBoris Johnson admits Brexit will not deliver on Vote Leave promise for immigration http://ind.pn/2bZP58k
Hahahahaha you racist tory sockpuppet
Should that be racist Tart an Tory 2 anti English Nat si.
DeleteCalling Germans 'Huns' then accusing Scots of being racist...
DeleteSad wee fuck.
The English ARE German.
DeleteAngles, Saxons, Jutes. Its where they came from.
Some of us are English Scots, Glasgow Working Class 2 and all the better for it. Get real.
DeleteHun is a derogatory term for Germans, much loved by... the English.
Delete'Huns' in Scotland means Rangers supporters.
English is a "nationality" not a RACE,dummy.
DeleteThe real choice is for Scotland to be run from Edinburgh or London.
DeleteNothing to do with hatred of the English. All to do with where to place Government to best serve the people. Answer as close as possible to where the people affected are. So in some cases it requires devolution to local councils, others to a Scottish Government (or English Region if you live there) and sometimes it involves giving up certain rights to a supranational body such as the UN or EU, as with Human Rights.
ReplyDeleteGWC you are emotionally obsessed with unionism instead of looking at the big picture. The union served us well for a long time but it has reached its use-by-date. Time to seek a new way forward and let go of the past.
You are a Nat si and emotionally obcessed with Nat si ism and an English hater. However if you can explain why you want to hand our Scotland over to German banking and political control then explain why!
DeleteYou are obsessed with British imperialism and a German hater. Maybe you should deal with your own problems.
DeleteI married an english girl so your assertion is invalid. There is no question of handing control to anyone other than a Scottish Government. The EU controls a lot less functions than Wastemonster. We would only go in to the EU if it suited Scotlands needs and remember we can always ScootExit if we don't like it. At the moment however we are stuck in a one sided union where the SE england sucks all the wealth from the other areas including North England. We have a way out they do not. We could always make a new offer to join a union with England/wales but the terms would have to be significantly improved from the current They win Scotland loses model.
DeletePS If you could keep the emotional bile down a bit it would be appreciated.
gwc, your Britnat si ism is getting more pathetic by the day.
DeleteDo you really think the EU would be able to drag Scotland into illegal wars, force us to be a nuclear target by foisting Trident on us, make Scottish police pay VAT when rest of UK doesn't, etc etc ..........the list is almost endless.
By the way, why does your Britnat si party desperately want to keep us in the UK - when we are just a drain on the finances? Still waiting for an answer to that, sockpuppet!!
What is an illegal war? When the Jocks invaded England and were slaughtered at Flodden was that an illegal invasion of a friendly country?
Delete"Friendly" would be a stretch.
DeleteGwc2
DeleteYou still haven't told us why you Britnat sis want to keep Scotland if we are such financial drain on your Britnat si world.
The sockpuppet is too busy snivelling with humiliation to provide a coherent answer.
DeleteSerious question : who gets to vote in said referendum and why? If only Scots living in Scotland what would it be? Scots born living anywhere? Seems like a country should start with who counts first.
ReplyDeleteThe last referendum used the Scottish Parliamentary voters register. Along with an inclusion of 16 and 17 year olds under the same rules.
DeleteBasically that means any person resident and registered to vote in Scotland. If you were say a generally resident individual but working outside Scotland you could vote via postal ballot. But not say if you were the 97 year old woman in London, born in Glasgow but taken south when she was 3 months old never to return even for a visit. She complained to a newspaper in 2014 that her democratic rights were being infringed.
So only those normally resident in Scotland seems to be the only feasible way.
Who counts, in your view, Bill?
DeleteCan an Englishman who now lives in Scotland? Do they cross reference the lists? If you grow up in Scotland but moved to the London area for a job, can you vote. I will think on who can vote!
DeleteThe franchise would be the same as in 2014. It's not clear what you think the big mystery is.
DeleteHey Bill pass a law through Holyrood this year to give the English a vote on Scottish Independence. Have a referendum next year and you Nat sis will have independence.
DeleteSnivelling racist Tory sockpuppet.
DeleteA lot of people in England like to whine about the Scots, but sadly, when it actually comes down to it, they're much more keen on Scotland staying in the Union than Scots themselves are.
DeleteAnyone aged 16 years and over and who is on the electoral register in Scotland.
DeleteCouldn't agree more Kangaroo.
ReplyDeleteIt's really that straightforward,bring the government within slapping distance and they have to run things the way the people want or we will find others who will.
Everything else is just detail.
The English ARE German.
ReplyDeleteAngles, Saxons, Jutes. Learn some history, dimbo.
Therefore that means the Germans are English. Who wid have thunk it.
DeleteStrange that all the Nat si propoganda after the brexit with wee Knickerless leading from the front and crawling tae the Germans and Frogs you Nat sis have not moved an inch forward. But how you Nat sis hate the English with a passion.
He has escaped again.
DeleteOld Edith Smelly Drawers Makes a Return. Could be a Movie in the making.
DeleteThe sockpuppet is semi-literate, hate-filled and racist. Are its deranged bleatings a form of job application for the Daily Suppress?
DeleteWhy does the Britnat si not answer the question about why Britnat sis are desperate to keep Scots in Britnat si land when we are such a big cost to them? Sockpuppet!!
DeleteHow does it actually feel being a knobend on a daily basis? Scotland is an independent country in a political Union with neighbours. If we leave this Union and then join the EU then we will be in another Union. You Nat si knobs will just not admit publicly that you just hate the English.
Delete"Scotland is an independent country"
Deletegwc2 says:- "How does it actually feel being a knobend on a daily basis?"
DeleteHas there ever been a more ironic post on this site???
Followed by :- "Scotland is an independent country"!!!
Is there no end to Britnat si, gwc2's idiocy (and lack of all political knowledge)?
Even 'sockpuppet' can't ever cover it. Where is his carer when she's needed?
The sockpuppet is beyond help. Just point and laugh as it humiliates itself here on a daily basis.
DeleteYes, he is beyond help, but when he said "You .. knobs will just not admit publicly that you just hate the English.", it really gave me problems because I'm in the SNP AND I'm English!! My question is, how much am I allowed to hate myself??!! Sockpuppet has completely lost it.
DeleteSockpuppet lost it a long time ago. The only service it's ravings provide is sparing us the horror of visiting the Daily Suppress to see how low our opponents will go.
DeleteThe whole of the UK should get a vote.
DeleteThe sockpuppet is beyond help. Just point and laugh as it humiliates itself here on a daily basis
Delete"The whole of the UK should get a vote."
DeleteThen we would definitely stay in. No ta.
Éoin @LabourEoin 5 hours ago
DeleteBBC News - Syria conflict: UK has just admitted it took part in the air strike that murdered 62 government troops
A poll of people's preferred scenarios has been done.
ReplyDelete33% Independent Scotland in EU
11% Independent Scotland outside EU
28% Scotland in UK & EU
23% Scotland in UK & outside EU
5% DK
33+28 = 61% stay
11+23 = 34% leave
33+11 = 44% yes
28+23 = 51% no
At first glance, this might look like bad news(EU & indy support slippage). But it looks like a ticking bomb for the UK as long as Brexit means Brexit. I'd love to recommission this poll and ask a follow-up question, with the third option(stay in both unions) removed.
Sort of AV style - see where that 28% goes when it becomes clear they can't have both. Until that breakdown is discovered, we're basically looking at 44-23%.
Greater potential more will favour the UK than the EU, yes... but six percent away from 50 is a heck of a lot closer. We only need a quarter of that group to favour the EU over the UK.
However, I am developing an aversion to believing these 'opinion polls', they are all done by private companies (with agendas!), and I believe they are out to influence opinion, not just record it.
DeleteOf course I am a cynic!
As a No voter last time I would vote for
ReplyDeleteindy2 now as we would expect to win again as wee Nicky knows so hence the listening exercise?
Nat sis do not listen.
DeleteThe sockpuppet is beyond help. Just point and laugh as it humiliates itself here on a daily basis
Delete@GWC2: I find it deeply offensive to compare nearly half of Scotland to the people responsible for the Holocaust. Nats, Jocks and Yoons are fairly innocent names to be throwing around but this whole Nat si thing needs to stop. You're comparing a group of people striving for independence with a movement responsible for millions of deaths. The two are incomparable.
ReplyDeleteOnly fools get offended by words. Nat si and Nazi are two different words.
DeleteRight, so we're to believe that "Nat si" was never meant to look or sound like Nazi? You just thought it had a nice ring to it or..?
DeleteIf you would believe that then you would believe anything. He is just offensive. I know some people who refused to donate to SGP because of him
DeleteYou Nat sis have a tendency to have strange imaginations. As well as hating the English you detest free speech of a kind contrary to your own opinions.
DeleteThe sockpuppet is beyond help. Just point and laugh as it humiliates itself here on a daily basis
DeleteThe SNP does have nazi origins however. They wanted to overthrow the British government in the 1930s and 40s with the help of ze jarmans and then the SNP would govern Scotland in a very similar way to the arrangement in Vichy France.
DeleteThis isn't ancient history. The man in question - Arthur Donalson - met many of the current generation of SNP leaders and was on good terms with them before his passing. So the nazi label is not entirely inappropriate.
Aldo
Founder of the tory party's 'Bible' and it's chief cheerleader, the Daily Mail.
DeleteMonths before war, Rothermere said Hitler's work was superhuman
The proprietor of the Daily Mail sent a series of supportive and congratulatory telegrams to Nazi Germany's leaders, including Hitler, just months before the second world war, papers released today reveal.
https://www.theguardian.com/media/2005/apr/01/pressandpublishing.secondworldwar
The modern Scottish independence movement is 84 years old, dating back to the 1928 formation of the National Party of Scotland, forerunner to the SNP. It is a peaceful, inclusive, civic and democratic movement – to the best of our knowledge, and almost uniquely, not a single life has been lost in pursuit of Scottish independence.
DeleteDespite this, so-called “Unionists” (more properly described as British nationalists) still regularly try to portray independence campaigners as violent racists. As recently as a few days ago, one prominent Labour activist frequently employed as a commentator on BBC Scotland political shows attempted to perpetuate baseless (but oft-repeated by Unionists) 70-year-old smears that the former SNP leader Arthur Donaldson was a Nazi sympathiser engaged in attempts to collaborate with the Germans during WW2, sabotage the British war effort and set up a Vichy-style government in Scotland. These claims were cited, astonishingly, as evidence of “the SNP’s fascist past”.
http://wingsoverscotland.com/civic-nationalism-vs-british-nationalism/
Senior Tory Grant Shapps received payoff during bullying scandal
DeleteFormer Conservative party co-chairman paid £8,000 after
resigning over scandal which led to death of Elliott Johnson
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/aug/18/senior-tory-grant-schapps-received-pay-off-bullying-scandal
Aldo:
Delete"According to papers released by MI5, which led raids against many Scottish nationalists, 'subversive literature' and a 'large cache of weapons' were found in Donaldson's house. The allegations in the MI5 files, which were first released in 1994 after Donaldson's death, were absolutely denied by his widow, Violet Donaldson, and by the surviving leaders of the SNP at the time. Donaldson was never charged, and no evidence for the MI5 allegations has ever been produced."
This doesn't sound like the most watertight case. But you're reporting it all as unvarnished fact, so I assume you have something more to go on?
Does Aldo think that the Queen is a Nazi because her uncle was an admirer?
DeleteSwinney now adopting more Tory policies in school funding.
ReplyDeleteThe sockpuppet is beyond help. Just point and laugh as it humiliates itself here on a daily basis
DeleteSuch a shame you have attracted a dire disrupter James.
ReplyDeleteMost interesting poll -I look forward to your analysis ,untrammeled by tennis . I was there on Friday - still trying to recover!
Another blinkered Nat si.
Deleteracist tory suckpuppet
DeleteI think more Yes voters will vote no given the current finacial state of the country. Our deficit is 10% and the allowable in the EU is about 3%. The correction required would mean almost a complete stop to public services (Greece is at 7.5%). The time is therefore no right for us. Another Tory win in 2020 and the stabilisation of our financial position means 2024 will be our time. If we rush it now and loose there will be no Indy Ref3, so patience and trust Nicola Sturgeon to time this right.
ReplyDeleteI suppose if we stopped paying for military projects which we can't afford,contributing to English infrastructure projects which we can't afford,bailing out banks which we can't afford and many other Westminster inflicted debts,we might not have this "deficit".
DeleteSo another poll shows NO still in the lead, despite the brexit vote and a Tory government that looks as though it will be in power for ever. Move along now folks, nothing to see here...
ReplyDeleteUnknown, 2024 is a fair wee while from now. You can't assume a sep majority in 2021 and anything beyond that is a mystery. You cannot assume you will be around forever and in a permanent position to choose your moment whenever you feel like it. That isn't being realistic. That's why most nats want an indyref ideally by next Thursday. They sense the moment is here and will soon pass unless they exploit it. Problem is, if you go too soon, you risk getting hammered again.
Aldo
Hi Aldo, I forgot to thank you for alerting me to this thrilling new poll, the latest of so many to show Scotland on the brink of independence. I was sitting at the tennis on Friday, and I probably wouldn't have spotted the poll if you hadn't been doing your usual trolling routine on behalf of the new No campaign.
DeleteYou're easy pleased. The poll shows you losing - and dropping support from the previous poll.
DeleteAldo
And yet it is only Unionists that are persisting with their campaigning message on Independence. Neither the SNP or any other Yes group are promoting the message (or at least if they are its getting no coverage).
DeleteMeanwhile, you'll never see a Loyalists on TV without a cheap lie about Independence being unviable or that somehow Scotland will keep paying for England (and therefore have a deficit) once Independent.
Only one side is putting out a message. But it's not getting any traction. Loyalists should be very, very worried.
You're very easily pleased, Aldo. You were happy when you thought Remain were going to win, because that would decrease the chances of independence. When you belatedly accepted that Leave had a chance, you were still happy, because Brexit would also decrease the chances of independence. When independence happens, you'll be happy, because on Planet Aldo even independence itself will decrease the chances of independence. You're probably the only unionist who won't be needing any happy pills as the years go by.
DeleteYou've got to see the good in everything James! I'll happily admit I was wrong about the EU referendum. But I was also wrong about its aftermath. I too suspected a big boost in support for independence. But it never happened and - the more you think about it - the more unrealistic a referendum seems. Brexit needs to be sorted out first. Christ knows how long that could take.
Delete"..even independence itself will decrease the chances of independence.." - this is actually possible, in a way. If we got for Scoxit and then everything falls apart and the negotiations are a complete failure, then it may just be that a unionist government is elected just in time to overturn the referendum result and save the union. Unlikely - but it's just one path that we could end up taking in the next few years. There are many things that can derail indy - and right up until the exact moment that the union flag is lowered and we officially become an independent state, nothing is certain. Be careful that your words, said in jest, do not turn out to be prophetic!
Aldo
"Be careful that your words, said in jest, do not turn out to be prophetic!"
DeleteDaily Mail Aldo has never knowingly been funny or prophetic, so no worries there. ;o)
"The undecideds and the bottlers will put it in the back of the net for 'remain'. I'm sure Cameron also has a few tricks up his sleeve to deploy in the dying days of the campaign."
Aldo
Confirmed! UN is investigating UK’s ‘grave violations’ of disabled people’s rights
ReplyDeleteThe United Nations is carrying out an unprecedented inquiry into “systematic and grave violations” of disabled people’s human rights by the UK government, Disability News Service (DNS) can finally confirm.
DNS revealed last August that the UK appeared to have become the first country to face a high-level inquiry by the UN’s committee on the rights of persons with disabilities (CRPD).
The committee said last summer, when approached by DNS, that it was not allowed to say whether the inquiry was underway.
But DNS is now in a position to state definitively that the inquiry is taking place, and has been underway since January 2014.
The inquiry was triggered by the grassroots campaigning organisation Disabled People Against Cuts (DPAC), which had grown increasingly concerned by the disproportionate impact of the coalition’s cuts on disabled people.
DPAC first contacted CRPD in 2012 and began to submit evidence about the coalition’s cuts and reforms in early 2013, with its request for an inquiry considered by the committee behind closed doors in April 2013.
http://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/confirmed-un-is-investigating-uks-grave-violations-of-disabled-peoples-rights/
The UN are an inept bunch of cronies subsidised by the big powers mainly the US. If the British Scottish cannot defend the elderly weak and poor then what is the point in having them. Tax the rich and middle classes.
DeleteThe troll calls scottish people "jocks", advocates arming Leave campaigners, claimed Jo Cox's husband was a fascist, uses racial and ethnic slurs, pretends to be Labour (badly) while espousing far-right racist hate-speech, praises Theresa May and the tories and displays a perverted poisonous obsession with Scotland's First Minister & her predecessor
DeleteI note you do not say I am English thus avoiding your rascist hatred of the English.
DeleteThe troll calls scottish people "jocks", advocates arming Leave campaigners, claimed Jo Cox's husband was a fascist, uses racial and ethnic slurs, pretends to be Labour (badly) while espousing far-right racist hate-speech, praises Theresa May and the tories and displays a perverted poisonous obsession with Scotland's First Minister & her predecessor
Deletethe racist tory sockpuppet always gets upset the most whenever the tories are slammed for their basic inhumanity and incompetence. it's so fucking obvious it's a tory twat absolutely furious at anyone daring to criticise the tories and theresa may
Deleteit's as shit as being a sockpuppet as it is thick
it is very very funny tho
LOL
Yup. Comedy gold from a sockpuppet too extreme even for BTL at the Dreary Heil and Daily Suppress.
DeleteHow time passes is it really twa years since the Nat sis were gubbed at the referendum.
ReplyDeleteSo what next, wee Knickerless and her devoted fash fan club going on about another referendum for years while they continue with Blue Tory policies.
The troll calls scottish people "jocks", advocates arming Leave campaigners, claimed Jo Cox's husband was a fascist, uses racial and ethnic slurs, pretends to be Labour (badly) while espousing far-right racist hate-speech, praises Theresa May and the tories and displays a perverted poisonous obsession with Scotland's First Minister & her predecessor
DeleteAlways worth a quick recap of the sockpuppet's greatest hits...
DeleteSubmissions to Theresa May’s child sex abuse inquiry 'accidentally' deleted
ReplyDeleteVictims of alleged child abuse who submitted testimonies to website between 14 September and 2 October deleted due to 'technical blunder'
Information provided by alleged child abuse victims to the overarching inquiry set up by Theresa May has been deleted due to a blunder, it has emerged.
Submissions sent through an online form to the inquiry between 14 September and 2 October were “instantly and permanently deleted” on Thursday before they reached staff.
The information had been sent to the “share your experience” section of the Independent Inquiry into Child Sex Abuse (IICSA) website, set up for victims and survivors wanting to share their experiences with officials working on the probe.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/oct/15/submissions-to-theresa-mays-child-sex-abuse-inquiry-accidentally-deleted
These polls are to be taken lightly. It is extremely likely that many no voters will now be yes voters, due to brexit. They are the ones who will suffer from brexit most. No more fancy holidays in the south of France, or at least not so many as it will be too costly. Their kids studying abroad, gone. Research grants, funding jobs in universities etc, gone. Easy, free trade for your small or medium size business, gone. Mostly middle class. the EU funding and freedom of movement, trade etc will not be welcome at all. Also lots folks' well educated grown up kids live in London, want easy travel,access to jobs etc,in other EU countries.
ReplyDeleteJust after the brexit vote had a young friend of my sons here and she said that all of her family and friends were now yes, all middle class, do not want out of the EU.
It will happen, and the. unionists are terrified. Watch out for false flag amd power cuts this coming winter. They will do anything to keep Scotland shackled, too much of an asset to let go that easily!
Can't wait to say bye bye union, and england, please stand on your own two feet, no more thieving Scotland's resources! Bye.
Anti English fash racist.
DeleteThe sockpuppet calls scottish people "jocks", advocates arming Leave campaigners and the creation of armed militias in every workplace, claimed Jo Cox's husband was a fascist, uses racial and ethnic slurs while claiming they're not derogatory, pretends to be Labour (badly) while espousing far-right racist hate-speech, praises Theresa May and the tories and displays a perverted poisonous obsession with Scotland's First Minister & her predecessor.
DeleteGwc - you really are an odious turd
Delete