Wednesday, December 9, 2015

How to tell if you're a Dalek

I'll keep this very brief because I'm in the middle of a technological apocalypse.  I suppose I always had a vague instinctive understanding that tomato sauce and computer keyboards don't really mix, but now I have the irrefutable proof.

I just wanted to make a passing comment on the notorious Loki article at Bella -

"Yes, you, the morally certain, reactionary branch of the dead Yes campaign...If Scotland is a cheap haircut you are its puritanical fringe...You intend to vote SNP twice next year because you love democracy.  You call the First Minister Nicola.  You think Braveheart is a documentary.  You have The National delivered directly to your ego and you live in a world where the next referendum is always around the corner – should the right crisis occur."

I'll have to plead guilty to at least two of those charges, although oddly enough calling the First Minister Nicola isn't one of them.  I may have done it once or twice, but in general I don't because it just feels wrong somehow.  (Although I do sometimes refer to Kezia Dugdale as "Kezia", so I'm not quite sure what the difference is.)

So, yes, I'm one of the people Loki is referring to, and did you notice how blatant his implication is that simply voting SNP on both ballots is enough to make us fanatics?  I'm not sure that actually understanding how the electoral system works, and realising that the list ballot is not a second preference vote, is something that should trouble our consciences or cause tortured soul-searching in front of the mirror at the dead of night.

You, of course, may reach a different conclusion, but my own view is that as long as you don't think Braveheart is a documentary, you're probably not a Dalek.

Kevin Williamson launched into a partial defence of Loki by claiming it is "FACT" that Nicola Sturgeon will not be proposing a second referendum in the SNP manifesto.  That's a "FACT" of the non-fact variety, because I'm aware of no evidence that there won't - at the very least - be wording in the manifesto that leaves open the possibility of a referendum in the event of Brexit.  Indeed, it would be a contradiction of everything that has been said so far if that isn't the case.

(And I know people are always itching at this point to say "Brexit won't happen", but try to restrain yourselves.  In a two-horse race it's always a good idea to consider the possibility that either horse may win, unless one of those horses is being ridden by John McTernan.)

149 comments:

  1. I read the "article" by that Loki person and it's pretty obvious [to me at least] that the person is in the middle of some kind of existential crisis. This was reinforced by their reply further down the thread. If unionists take comfort from such individual self-flagellation then they have even greater problems.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Braveheart is not a documentary?

    But...that can't be true.... So it's all been for nothing?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. When WW was being butchered he shouted, 'I'm Better together'......

      Delete
    2. Thanks Marcia that's the best laugh I have had in ages. In fact I almost fell apart!

      Delete
    3. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    4. That was so good Marcia

      Delete
  3. @ SS, I'm as shocked as you are. That William Wallace bloke is a great actor though.

    ReplyDelete
  4. What do you mean Braveheart wasn't a documentary? That's just like saying Robin Hood was all made up.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Ah you forget, all our history is made up, Edward First of England pinched most of our documents when he invaded. Only Mother England remains pure and untouched. Robin Hood really did exist(?) and everything they say is true including that our History is rubbish.
      Funny how secure they feel that their history is never of the box.

      Delete
  5. I thought Loki's piece was pretty peculiar, which is why I engaged with it and felt impelled to write my own blog in response. I rarely list Bella these days, because I just can't take reading self-defeating nonsense like that; of course in the eyes of Bella's editors and the right-on types who agree with Loki's views, that makes me part of the problem and guilty as charged of the heinous crimes detailed in his angst fuelled diatribe.

    If you read his responses on Bella, and some of his tweets, he does genuinely seem to have had some form of crisis of conscience post No vote. My main beef with his take on the current situation is not so much that it provides aid and comfort to the enemy (who are hardly short of resources as it is), but that it basically reflects that part of the political spectrum in Scotland which puts attaining independence behind fighting for socialism/the environment/fighting poverty/preventing fracking [insert hobby horse issue of choice here].

    The right-on zealots who believe as Loki does are actually quite in tune with the britnat narrative that says: "you lost, get over yourselves, use the powers you have to make things better". It's the dialogue of despair and represents a "weltanschauung" I find both repulsive in its own terms, but also desperately inappropriate as a response to events since September 2014.

    I don't doubt Loki's sincerity, or his right to that opinion, I just think his analysis is so flawed, so wildly out of kilter with what has actually happened in Scotland, and where we are now, that I wonder what world he inhabits? Why else would he actually believe that the appropriate response is to turn his guns on his own side, and that the kinds of progress he wants to see will be more likely without independence, than with it?

    ReplyDelete
  6. Loki is, as has been said, entitled to have and express his opinion. However it seems an odd contradiction for someone to imply he is a free thinker yet want to label everyone else he does not appear to agree with. Life and people are just not that easily predictable.

    ReplyDelete
  7. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  8. I've pretty well stopped bothering with Bella these days. It was OK when it started but now.....

    ReplyDelete
  9. Sorry I spilled duplicating ink over my keyboard!!

    ReplyDelete
  10. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Don't worry Nodrog, it's that deja vu all over again.

    ReplyDelete
  12. Alistair Carmichael cleared.

    Much wailing and gnashing of teeth on social media tonight - should be fun!

    Aldo

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The decision of the court will hurt you more than it hurts us.

      Delete
    2. He didn't break the law. I heard a very good explanation of it on the radio just now. When asked if he'd leaked the memo, he said "no". That is not a false statement in relation to his character. Had he instead said "No - I would never do such an evil thing. Not Alistair Carmichael! How very dare you sir - I challenge you to a duel!", then self talking in relation to his own moral character would have applied and he'd be out on his ear at this moment. But he simply said "no" - and so the law does not apply in this case.

      I fail to see why a correct interpretation of law should hurt unionists. We should be relieved that the law has been applied fully and fairly - there are many countries where it is not.

      Aldo

      Delete
  13. Wonderful news from the election court just now as that vile, spiteful and politically-motivated challenge is deservedly thrown out by the judges. I hope the petitioners are whacked with costs too.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. 'vile, spiteful and politically-motivated challenge'

      'I hope the petitioners are whacked with costs too'

      Titter. Yoon self awareness in all its glory.

      Delete
  14. vile, spiteful and politically motivated...Alistair Carmichael, right?

    ReplyDelete
  15. According to sep facebook pages I have visited, the petitioners are £40,000 in debt.

    If Carlsberg did election court challenges.....

    Aldo

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Rotten.Rotten to the core.

      Delete
    2. Poetic justice.

      Aldo

      Delete
    3. Ha ha, Aldo you are truly pathetic.

      Delete
    4. At least I'm not 40 grand in debt as the result of a failed political witch hunt.

      Aldo

      Delete
    5. Neither am I and neither will the petitioners be. They raised another 3K this morning alone.

      Morons like you will just motivate others to donate.

      I can't wait to see your replies when they burst the target and your little delusional bubble.

      Al don't.

      Delete
    6. Even if they manage to pay their legal bills, they will still have failed. You might as well throw money down a toilet.

      Delete
    7. Rubbish. The Liberal Democrats have been hugely damaged as a result of this case, especially in the Northern Isles.

      Delete
    8. Hamish! Why did you sell the car, remortgage the house and raid that wee fund I was saving up for when Ruiraidh turns 18 and goes to fishing college????!!!!!

      Relax woman! Ye can rest safe in ra knowledge that we have damaged the liberal democratic party! Yer faither wid be proud ae iz - he ay hated them!

      Do you realise whit ye've done. You've bankrupted us!

      Silence woman! Women will be silent and know their place in the new Scotland!

      But whit about yon Sturgeon?

      She will be removed and a suitably bearded gentleman put in her place SAOR ALBA!

      Delete
  16. You presumably have not read the judgement? Carmichael is a Liar. He lied for Electoral advantage. Both judicially established facts. Nothing at all to be pleased about in that, unless you believe that lying for political advantage is acceptable. But perhaps you do.

    ReplyDelete
  17. So Carmichael is guilty as sin; just walks on a technicality. I look forward to the main Lib Dem trial in May next year. If I was McArthur or Scott, I'd be making alternative career plans to be on the safe side. I'd also not be sending Carmichael Christmas cards any more.

    ReplyDelete
  18. I am pleased that this nationalist attempt to silence opposition has failed. Those who are behind it better be braced for a large costs bill :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Carmichael is a proven liar,according to the judgement.Nobody will pay much attention to what he has to say in future.He has,through his duplicity,silenced himself.As for the costs,well,I don't expect that to be much of an issue.

      Delete
    2. Don't worry Anon , we'll pick up the bill !

      Delete
    3. Good, I hope you do and in a timely fashion. Get your chequebooks out boys and girls :)

      Delete
    4. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 1:22 PM

      What did the Nat sis lie about before and during the referendum campaign?
      And why did the Nat sis vote to stay in NATO and retain the Monarch when their majority of membership were against. As well as lies they attempted deceit to win over NO voters. And the witch hunt against Carmichael failed.

      Delete
    5. Shut it GWC.

      Delete
    6. I see the cybernats are handling this defeat with their customary good grace and charm

      Delete
    7. Defeat? Oh, grow up.

      Delete
  19. Politicians lie. They exaggerate. They spin. They misrepresent. They twist. They selective ignore. Politicians are dishonest. It was your demi-god Alex Salmond himself who said "politics is the art of the possible". I've thought about that statement a lot - and, to me, it basically means 'use whatever means you can to get what you want - up to and including lying your ass off'.

    And didn't the SNP and Yes Campaign do just that? The surge of nationalism we are currently seeing in Scotland was fuelled by lies - yet there is not even a suggestion of the 54 losing their seats.

    These judges did what they had to do - they kept a level playing field.

    Aldo

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. 'politics is the art of the possible;

      It was Bismark, as any fule kno.

      Delete
    2. "The best people to run a country are the people who live there".Thats the truth behind the continueing growth in support for independence.

      Delete
    3. The SNP live here and can't maintain a bridge...

      Aldo

      Delete
    4. Lol. You are clutching at straws Aldo.

      Delete
    5. Aldo,
      Such a colonialistic attitude is part of the reason you're losing the ongoing debate.Osborne will do nothing to turn the tide.

      Delete
    6. I don't think the businesses and people who rely on the Forth Road Bridge will believe I am clutching at straws - and the bridge is just the latest in a long line of SNP failures that will, eventually, come home to roost - once the post referendum emotional spasm reaches its end.

      How does pointing out SNP incompetence demonstrate a "colonialistic attitude"? And where's this empire anyway that you keep talking about?

      Aldo

      Delete
    7. And which party has instigated the building of a replacement bridge?

      Delete
    8. That bridge wont open for another year. The present one would still be operating had they actually fixed it 5 years ago rather than cancelling repairs.

      Aldo

      Delete
  20. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  21. George Osborne has ruled out another indyref on his watch if he becomes Prime Minister. So, Cameron having done the same, that rules out another go until 2025 at the earliest - unless, of course, the Corbynator and Chairman Mao get in. Then anything's possible for the laws of physics will have already been smashed by the general election result.

    Aldo

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. You are delusional. You can't stop another referendum if there's public will to do it. If the George/pig man acted like that then they would increase the Yes vote.

      Think about it.

      Delete
    2. It is well within the rights of the Prime Minister of a country to not hold a referendum - especially when the same question was asked recently and the proposal rejected. I think anyone arguing against that simple reality is the delusional one.

      Aldo

      Delete
    3. Nope, only in your delusional bubble is it correct. I doubt you will find much support of your views anywhere in Scotland. The ability to call a referendum on anything is in the power of the people, not in the minds of irrelevant little nyafs like yourself.

      Al don't.

      Delete
    4. Scotland can't make decisions in a vacuum. We are part of a much larger nation and any process of Scotland becoming independent must be by joint consent.

      Aldo

      Delete
    5. No where is that written in law, regardless, we live in a democracy the people make decisions of that scale. So to conclude, you're talking out yer erse.

      Al don't.

      Delete
    6. In a unitary state, the final say on secession lies with the central government. And that's an internationally accepted way of doing things.

      Besides, the people already decided. They said no to your money tree funded, braveheartist fantasy.

      Delete
    7. Tell that to the USA 200 years ago...

      Oh, right.

      The final say on *anything* in a nation is made by the people who live there. It's just a matter of how much they'll put up with before they tell any "central government" to go take a run and jump, and then how much military force the "central government" is able to apply, compared to the amount of military force the people living in the nation can muster.

      That's the hard reality. Anything else relies on "gentlemen's agreements" and social constructs, neither of which are as strong as people like to believe.

      The art of governing is keeping people happy enough to not go into open revolt, the tories know this, but like to walk as close to the line as they can.

      Delete
    8. It's a union state, not a unitary state.

      Delete
    9. It is a unitary state, internationally recognised as such. That means there is one true sovereign government with authority over all of the United Kingdom - based in London, with the parliament in Edinburgh as a mere subsidiary of it. That is the legal position and will not change no matter how much emotive guff is spouted about "ra peepul!"

      Aldo

      Delete
    10. You're confusing ink on paper with power again...

      All the ink on paper, and all the arguments that something is illegal hold no weight unless we allow them to.

      For example, it has generally been agreed on by lawyers on both sides of the pond that the revolution in the American colonies ~200 years ago was illegal.

      Also, if the law was absolutely correct at all times, why do we let anyone change it?

      Because when it comes right down to the line, "legal" means nothing. We follow the law either because we would do that anyway, and whether we're required by law to or not makes no difference, or because if we don't, people with guns will come and shoot us.

      Arguing that "it's the law" is a fallacy, because laws can (and do) get changed.

      Look up jury nullification for another example.

      Delete
    11. I will agree that the rule of law can be subverted in a violent revolution. Is that what you are calling for?

      America paid taxes but had no political representation. So they had justification that we do not in pursuing their war of independence. They had the support of France - then a global power rivalling Britain. And - hello - it's America! Absolutely huge, covering nearly an entire continent and separated from us by an ocean! Any comparison with Scotland is ridiculous.

      If UDI is attempted in Scotland, the Scottish Parliament will be suspended indefinitely and you will have no way of fighting back and no international support. If Trump happens to be president, after today's events, he'll probably offer to put the SNP up in Guantanamo Bay :0)

      Delete
    12. Furthermore, yes, the law can be changed - but only by the Westminster Parliament in this respect. The SNP attempted an amendment to the Scotland Bill that would have gave Holyrood power to call legally binding independence referenda. It was defeated in the parliament, heavily. So I would rule out a change in law giving you what you want.

      Guess that just leaves the revolution. Good luck!

      Delete
    13. I seem to remember Iceland having a rather peaceful revolution not that long ago...

      Delete
  22. Aldo, you're very sweet and funny in your way. Do you remember Osborne's great intervention in the referendum debate? His Sermon on the Pound was one of the biggest weapons the Yes campaign had. Do you honestly think that him saying he won't ALLOW Scots to vote on their future won't provoke serious and sustained anti-union sentiment?

    As for Carmichael, he lied. Everyone knows he lied. He admits he lied. It's frustrating, actually, that he was on trial over one lie when the original lie had already been used to beat his political opponents for days and days during a febrile election campaign. He is apparently NOTHING but a liar. The judges made a ruling that many of us find perplexing; after all, if there was no harm to his personal reputation from the truth, why did he lie at all? If, on the other hand, it was a purely political lie, then what are we supposed to infer about our politicians more generally? That lying is fine as long as you never say that you personally think lying is bad and you're not a habitual liar? It's awful on so many levels. The man's grotesque arrogance before, during and since this episode is execrable too. He should be thoroughly ashamed of himself, as should the media organs now reporting that he was "cleared of misleading voters" (he absolutely was NOT "cleared" of such a thing - the judges specifically noted that he had told a "blatant lie" with the intention of affecting the election result) and the unionist drones who think this is a victory for "decent" or "proper" politics.

    I hope someone's doing an independence poll some time soon. It'll be fascinating to see if this dishonest toad's behaviour has had the impact I suspect it might...

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. It was the currency debate that holed the SNP / Yes campaign below the waterline. Osborne's point blank refusal to share the pound damaged them seriously. Only if you occupy a parallel universe do you think it helped the yes campaign.

      Carmichael lied, yes. So did Salmond, Swinney, Sturgeon etc - and their lies were more serious. A country will not collapse over a leaked memo.

      And the most important thing here - Carmichael did not break the law. Lying isn't illegal by the way. If it were, Salmond would be in Barlinnie on a whole life tariff.

      Aldo

      Delete
    2. Where's your evidence? The polls suggest otherwise.

      Al don't.

      Delete
    3. Didn't you follow the campaign? Didn't you watch the debates? Currency dogged the YeSNP more than any other issue.

      Aldo

      Delete
    4. I did and that's simply untrue. Again Aldo, you are in a dream world.

      Al don't

      Delete
    5. You must have been following the wrong referendum then.

      Delete
    6. LOL, the unionists liked to think that people actually care about the pictures on the trade tokens that get used, and where they're made.

      As long as the local shops take them, and the local banks will trade them for stuff for holidays, I don't give a stuff.

      Delete
    7. Those units of currency - the value of them, the availability of them, the level of confidence in them - matter when people have to earn, pay their way and pay down debts. If you think it doesn't matter, great - go on thinking that. You do the union a favour.

      Aldo

      Delete
    8. I don't really understand your point there.

      As long as your pay rises in proportion, the less money you have the more inflation benefits you.

      And as for other countries' confidence in a Scottish Pound, I believe the phrase was "potentially the hardest currency in the EU"

      Also, a good sized chunk of the Royal Mile in Edinburgh takes Euros already (and I think I've seen one that takes US Dollars as well), I don't see why an independent Scotland would even need an official currency.

      Again, I think you might be arguing as though ink on paper has more importance than it actually has.

      Delete
    9. The value of the Scottish currency would be next to zero with the oil crash and Salmond's debt default. But let's not allow first year economics to get in the way of the braveheartist fantasy.

      Delete
    10. You mean the oil crash that would still have brought in enough money to fund the entire Scottish NHS with cash to spare?

      And what debt default? The one where we refuse to pay for England's loans? That pretty much exclusively went to London?

      Delete
  23. Now that Cameron and his likely successor have both ruled out revisiting this issue, this leaves the SNP with only one realistic option - use their powers to govern Scotland effectively as part of the United Kingdom in the hope of a long term revival of their main cause if they do well at governing.

    The braveheartists can shout and bawl about multi-coloured tories and the 'unfairness' of the indyref veto as much as they like. It wont change the political reality of there not being one. And should the SNP become paralysed due to obsession and angst over this single issue, they will be ejected from office.

    Time to start governing chaps - you can start by fixing that bridge you neglected.

    Aldo

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Aldo, you are living in a dream world.

      Fortunately we all live in a democracy, so your views are irrelevant.

      Al don't.

      Delete
    2. Yep, we live in a democracy. So expect the referendum result to be upheld.

      Delete
    3. Until the next one.

      Remember the line "no government can bind their successors"?

      We hold another referendum, and it overrules the old one.

      Simple, yes? Most recent result takes precedence.

      Delete
    4. Indeed. No government can bind its successor. However, as Cameron and Osborne are highly likely to hold the PM post, with a majority, for the next ten years, then it's basically guaranteed that there will be no further referenda for a decade, at least.

      Aldo

      Delete
    5. And now you're assuming that Holyrood needs Westminster's permission to ask the people of Scotland what they want...

      They don't.

      I know Westminster likes to claim that they do, but as we've all seen now, we can't believe a word they say.

      Delete
    6. They cannot hold a legally binding referendum. Any referendum they did hold would be boycotted by unionists - leading to a result I'm sure Saddam Hussein would be proud of. The Scottish parliament - and Scotland generally - would be a laughing stock. We would also continue as a part of the United Kingdom and there would be nothing the seps could do about it.

      Delete
    7. *Westminster* cannot hold a legally binding referendum either. *All* referendums in the UK are only advisory.

      And if people decided to abstain from voting in a referendum on their countries future, then that's on them.

      Delete
  24. Man what a scandal this is developing into. Last thing Ruth needs ahead of May 16.

    I mean half her candidates were already unelectable so have to be deselected in a 'Stalinist purge' that would make red Ken blush, now Tory HQ is really making her life a misery with a full on sex, bullying and intimidation scandal which led to the death of a young activist.

    Never a good sign when suddenly colleagues are rushing to defend. All we need is Dave saying 'I have full confidence in him...' and we'll know what'll happen next.

    Question is, as this has been going on for what 10 years, how much did Dave know? Surely he knew this was a problem? Why did he do nothing?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-35049881

    Then we have Tory economic credibility going down the pan... Voters swinging rapidly against the Syria air strikes...

    No wonder Ruth wants to distance the Scots Tories from London and limit Dave's visits ahead of May.

    Omnishambles #2

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I hear Murdo may be biding his time and waiting for the inevitable fallout from Ruth's latest lunacy. Because if tory members and supporters, (what's left of them) or even some of the tory BOOers down south, get wind of some of the actual 'criteria' on which Ruth's 'new model scots tory MSPs' were chosen.. well. Let's just say that Ruth still does as she's telt and word from on high (the weak Hameron) hath decreed that he needs another bunch of fiercely Eurosceptic 'troublemaker' and "bastard" tories like a hole in the head right now. What with the inevitable tory split on Europe looming large on the horizon. ;-)

      Though, to be fair, some have at least already realised that when Ruth says 'modern' she means what the fop Cameron and Osbrowne consider 'modern' and that is very, VERY far from the tory grassroots views.

      Hameron and Osbrowne's utter contempt for hardline Eurosceptic "dinosaurs" making trouble for Hameron's chumocracy has been abundantly clear for years.

      Delete
  25. Nobody I know will be particularly surprised by Carmichael escaping on a technicality. Since most were well enough informed to realise that the ambiguity of personal lie V's political lie would be where the technicality could be found.

    Moreover, the judgement itself is still absolutely excoriating to the buffoon and liar Carmichael.

    On the first issue, the court observed that the first respondent [Mr Carmichael] had told a “blatant lie” when, in the course of a Channel 4 interview on Sunday 5 April 2015, he claimed that he had only become aware when contacted by a journalist of a memo leaked to the press by his special adviser Euan Roddin, which stated that First Minister and leader of the SNP Nicola Sturgeon had told the French ambassador that “she’d rather see David Cameron remain as PM”.

    Lady Paton said: “There is no dispute that the words ‘I told you the first I became aware of this, and this is already on public record, was when I received a phone call on Friday afternoon [i.e. Friday 3 April 2015] from a journalist making me aware of it’ constituted a false statement of fact, in other words, a lie. Obviously the first respondent had been aware of the existence of the memo and its contents as described to him by Mr Roddin since the flight to the Faroe Islands in March 2015. Moreover he had authorised Mr Roddin to release the memo to the Daily Telegraph.”

    However, on the matter of whether the lie could properly be characterised as a false statement of fact “in relation to [his] personal character or conduct”, the judges were left with a reasonable doubt.

    “It is of the essence of section 106 that it does not apply to lies in general: it applies only to lies in relation to the personal character or conduct of a candidate made before or during an election for the purpose of affecting that candidate’s return,” Lady Paton said.

    On the second issue, the judges were satisfied that it had been proved beyond reasonable doubt that the first respondent made the false statement of fact “for the purpose of affecting (positively) his own return at the election”.

    Lady Paton said: “As the first respondent said in evidence, he wanted public attention to remain focused on that important political message, rather than becoming side-tracked by revelations that it had been he and his special adviser Mr Roddin who had leaked the memo to the Daily Telegraph. In his view, if public attention remained focused on that political message, voters who had anxieties about Scottish independence might find voting for the SNP a less attractive prospect…The inescapable inference, in our opinion, is that if the SNP became a less attractive prospect, the first respondent’s chances of a comfortable majority in what had become a ‘two-horse race’ in Orkney and Shetland would be enhanced.”

    Furthermore, the judges considered that the evidence established that there was another purpose underlying the false statement, namely a desire not to be identified as being involved in the leak.

    “Thus on the basis of all the evidence led before us we are satisfied beyond reasonable doubt that another purpose underlying the false statement was self-protection (a self-protection extending to Mr Roddin, provided that neither of them could be identified). Such self-protection would avoid attracting critical comment, losing esteem in the public eye, and being the subject of any disciplinary consequences, all at a very inconvenient time during the lead-up to the election. Such self-protection would avoid his presenting as a less attractive electoral candidate for the voters in Orkney and Shelland





    Let's see Carmichael campaign on that platform anytime soon. LOL

    So anyone hilariously deluded enough to think the lib dems, Rennie and the liar Carmichael come out of this well are clearly the same kind of cretinous out of touch twits who made such an amusing fool of themselves over the Oldham by-election. :0)

    ReplyDelete
  26. aldo-do you live in the dark with your mushrooms.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Magic variety judging by some of the posts.

      Delete
  27. Should I or shouldn't I?

    Should I get a 6 pack of Peroni in to celebrate the unionist victory in the Carmichael case and Osborne's indyref announcement?

    Midweek drinking is not usually my thing but as we're also quite close to Christmas, feck it.

    Six pack of Peroni it is! :0)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Any excuse, eh?

      I'm guessing midweek drinking is on the cards an awfae lot.

      Delete
    2. Why does some whoreshagging cokehead talking bollocks get you so excited? Are you one to?

      Delete
    3. Not really. But a smack in the mouth for the seps is always worthy of a wee drink!

      Delete
    4. I suppose a Unionist has to take whatever solace he can find in these dark electoral times!

      Delete
    5. I get to spend the next 5 years watching the SNP carry their fine china across an ice rink and failing badly. What's not to like?

      Delete
  28. Anyone who calls that absolutely damning indictment of the Court on Carmichael as a Blatant Liar, whose credibility wsa completely shredde by the Judges, thus -


    "We had no concerns about the credibility and reliability of the witnesses, with one exception: that related to the first respondent’s evidence that, in the context of questions about the source of the leak, he was not concerned about his reputation or his standing in the constituency. In our opinion the evidence generally, and in particular the evidence about the furious reaction to the leak, the immediate investigation into its source, and the first respondent’s disingenuous approach when responding to the Cabinet Office inquiry, taken with the first respondent’s own evidence in court, proved beyond reasonable doubt that the first respondent hoped not to be identified as being involved with the leak, all as further discussed in paragraphs [65] and [68] to [70] below.

    We accordingly did not accept the first respondent’s evidence on that matter."

    - is as much of a Cretin as Carmichael himself.

    Head of the queue - Aldo.

    A Unionist Cretin personified.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. His only offence is lying David and that is not a criminal offence. No law was broken.

      So that just leaves us with lying. He's in good company - your demi god Salmondo the great told some real whoppers.

      Delete
    2. As proven in a Court of Law and as admitted by the oerson concerned?

      Evidence on both, please.

      Delete
    3. The moon is made of jelly.

      There - I told a lie. A court of law is not needed to confirm that what I said is, indeed, a lie.

      It just so happens that my lie is obvious and harmless. The lies of Salmond and the SNP in general were egregious and could have resulted in the Scottish people making a terrible mistake (B of E, currency union, EU legal advice, North Sea oil, Scotland's fiscal position etc).

      Their lies were absolutely damning. Carmichael is a saintly figure in comparison.

      Aldo

      Delete
  29. Astonishing the number of demented quislings defending the self-confessed liar.

    How can the disgraced MP possibly represent his constituents? He's a liar. Condemned as a liar by two judges. A lying liar form a party of child abuser protecting lairs.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. How can the disgraced MP possibly represent his constituents?

      Spoken without a trace of irony.

      Delete
  30. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 6:39 PM

    SNP are cereal liars.

    ReplyDelete
  31. 'Carmichael is guilty of lying through his teeth' court case files are of course off to the Westminster parliamentary standards committee. There might yet be a by-election.

    If they let him off, it's 1-0 to independence supporters.

    If they don't, it's 1-0 to independence supporters.

    All good.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. You are absolutely correct.

      Only the dumbest of Unionists - Aldo and McGibbon - could fail to see the effect of all this on Scottish voters.

      Unionist politicians/Unionism has just taken yet another kick in the teeth from the Judges' comments on Carmichael.

      Unionism-and-Lying are even more firmly entrenched in the minds of Scots, than ever before.

      Happy Days.

      Delete
    2. David, apart from hard line unionists and hard line nationalists - who are either celebrating this as a great victory or squirming uncomfortably - no one cares. This will not have a profound effect on voters.

      Now, that gubbed bridge out in Edinburgh, that has the potential to really annoy quite a lot of people. I suggest you head down there right now and volunteer yourself as unskilled labour, in repentance for your party's incompetence - self flagellating as you go.

      Aldo

      Delete
  32. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 6:55 PM

    I think the British government should allow the likes of Dumfries and Galloway and Orkney and Shetland remain in the Union. Some regions should be allowed to opt out of a referendum if they want. Our Britishness should not be taken away from us because of English hating fanatics.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Never thought you'd support Glasgow becoming independent tomorrow along with the other areas that voted Yes last year, with these forming an embryonic indy Scotland.

      That's quite a change of heart.

      Delete
    2. Shetland actually voted SNP in May. It was only the Orkney numpties that kept the Brit Nat closet Tory slug Carmichael in a job that he doesn't deserve. They wont even get a chance to elect a proper Brit Nat Liberal now. Oh and Dumfries and Galloway did that not go SNP as well in May. You can keep Edinburgh South in UKOK for all I care

      Delete
    3. Did you come up with this after reading your bumper colouring book of 20th century Irish History? Do all yes voters meet your definition of English haters?

      Delete
    4. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 8:33 PM

      If I had the privalege of meeting a Nat si with a sense of humour I would have some faith in the human race.

      Delete
    5. Disintegration

      Delete
    6. There is no reason why regions geographically contiguous with England who vote no should not be given the opportunity to 'secede from Scotland' as it were (and remain in the United Kingdom). To argue that everything is divisible bar Scotland in its present form doesn't really stand up. It reveals an irony I find quite amusing - upon achieving independence our sep friends would instantly become the new unionists; "So, Dumfries and Galloway! You wish to leave the glorious Caledonian empire?? You'll have the emperor and his death star to answer to!!!!!!"

      Once you begin unravelling a society, why not go whole hog and give Jedburgh a vote on self determination? Has Scotland been divinely ordained as an indivisible land. Are we the new chosen people?

      Israel is going to be pissed.

      Delete
  33. Carmichael should now cover the cost of the official Leak Enquiry by Westminster.

    After all, all he had to do was say "It was me" and none of it would have been required.

    The cost to the Taxpayer was £1.4 Million.

    Fair's fair - the proven Liar should foot that entire bill - as he caused the whole shambles to happen, by giving the Leak the go-ahead and then keeping his trap shut.

    The Lying Slug should be bankrupted.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 8:28 PM

      I assume you would not have a problem if the pre referendum Nat sis were up in court for their porkies.eg: currency and EU membership.
      Not heard wee Nicola or Kim Yung Eck giving their examles of perfect states we should model ourselves on. Eg: ROI the celtic tiger, Iceland and Scandanavian countries. Maybe even Greece.

      Delete
    2. Which lies were they, pervert?

      Your beloved Darling stated on live TV that Scotland could use the pound (our own pound we've supported with our taxes for 300 years mind) After the UK ceased to exist.

      The only person who could get a definitive ruling about the status of Scotland and England post the end of the UK was D Cameron. He refused to do so for some reason. Afraid of the answer no doubt.

      Your extreme racism and xenophobia are noted. Does K Dogface know you're in breach of labour's new internet protocols?

      Eat your cereal.

      Delete
    3. Sorry McGibbon, deflection just won't work.

      Carmichael has been career-defined by Court Judges as A BLATANT LIAR.

      No ifs, buts or maybes - he has been confirmed as A BLATANT LIAR by an impartial judiciary.

      Lap it up, loser.

      Delete
    4. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 8:55 PM

      Pervert! What kind? You Nat sis wanted to pull out of the 300 year agreement therefore you pull out entirely. You did not even have the brains to ask for renegotiation of the Union settlement. Cake and eat it was not on. You were well warned in advance about the currency but did not have a brain amongst you to devise an alternative. Mugs and numpties.
      Hiv tae say it wis fun watchin youz greetin yer een oot on 20 September 2014. Never laughed so much at bitter hateful losers.

      Delete
    5. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 9:02 PM

      I do not care about Libs you old Nat si muppet. They are as anti wurkin class as you Nat sis and your Tory pals. People are supposed tae mature when they get old. You just pour out the Nat si venom.

      Delete
    6. Get up to date, pal.

      Unionism is dying a very messy death up here, now.

      If it was a horse, it would be shot.

      No wonder you are shitting large bricks and are so bitter and upset.

      The whole thing is running away from you and you have no answers.

      Next year - increased SNP majority Govt.

      Then possible Brexit, with all the repercussions in Scotland.

      Tories fragmenting on EU, as a bonus.

      Labour going nowhere, anywhere in UK.

      LibDems finished.

      Happy Days Indeed.

      Delete
    7. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 9:13 PM

      You must have meant tae send that tae yerself for personal reassurance. Means nuffin tae me.

      Delete
    8. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 9:45 PM

      Just a winner alt muppet. You will be pan breid by the time we ever have another referendum. Wee Nicola is shitin herself tae go fur it.

      Delete
    9. Iron your sash.

      Delete
    10. LOL!

      Nah, I will easily see you out, McGibbon - with all your obvious blood-pressure problems AND I will take my bow in an Independent Scotland, that is for sure.

      Your lot are merely yesterday's bad dreams and will play a very minor part in my Country's future.

      Get used to it, ya fud.

      Delete
    11. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 9, 2015 at 10:43 PM

      David speaks fae his cough in. Wan fit in the grave. Anon is it time for your shift change. Ye dae merr oors than the watch dugs. Are you the Nat si cuttin edge!! the Trump card fur ra Nat sis.

      Delete
    12. I see the seps are still pinning their hopes on Brexit. Oh dear! It shows how desperate things have become when all you can do is hope for something that is as unlikely as it is contrary to your own politics :0)

      Aldo

      Delete
    13. If a referendum 2 were called, the mood in the nationalist camp would be one of jubilation - for about 0.23 milliseconds - followed by stress, fear and outright horror among some. Basically, you can't win. You don't have a case. Everything the unionists warned of last time has come to pass. Everything the SNP scaremongered about, well, hasn't. You would be demolished by a new campaign - which would also see the unionists holding the moral high ground (we just did this a couple of years ago - why are we back here again?). It would be a torrid time for every nationalist, followed by certain defeat. And, if you lose twice, that's it - the end. Truly. The ideology of Scottish nationalism will be getting a wee visit from that boney bloke in the black cloak.

      Aldo

      Delete
    14. I did not realise that Scotland had voted to be Indy...did that happen recently?


      mogabee

      Delete
    15. So, with pretty much every promise that the "Better Together" campaign made in tatters, you think the Unionists would have an easy ride?

      Delete
    16. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 10, 2015 at 7:23 PM

      Aldo, the Nats would be at a loss. They told porkies and would have to make up more. They should face their day in court for their lies and personaly pay back the costs of the referendum to the taxpayer.

      Delete
    17. Ha ha ha. Now go eat your cereal

      Delete
    18. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 10, 2015 at 8:16 PM

      Anon, strange the Nat sis have never explained why they want Germany to run Scotland. The Scottish groat being run on the Frankfurt Stock exchange would be novel.

      Delete
    19. Ho Ho Ho. Now eat your cereal.

      Delete
    20. Unionists. Warned oil was volatile. So it turned out to be. It is now less than $40 a barrel - Salmond suggested a floor of $113. We warned Scotland was seriously in deficit. Comments by nationalists since the referendum have confirmed it - with one indicating that even full fiscal autonomy would be economic suicide. The British government promised extensive new devolution in the event of a no vote and has delivered handsomely. From next year we can adjust taxation and welfare programmes in Scotland to help "ra poor". There is no limit to how much Scotland pays in benefits - provided Scotland foots the extra tax bill. Amazingly - and most generously - Barnett is retained.

      SNP / Yes. Said the NHS would be privatised in the event of a no vote. There has been no such privatisation. Warned Holyrood would be dissolved. No such luck - they are beefing it up. Warned Scotland would be "punished". Oh, yes please mistress!

      Unfortunately, no punishment forthcoming either.

      If you were an alien who had just landed from Proxima Centauri, who would you believe to be most trustworthy?

      Delete
    21. Now away and eat your cereal.

      Delete
  34. Haven't heard a word from that little cretin Rennie in defence of Carmichael. He's too worried about the 5th of May next year to open his mouth

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Aye, normally you can't have a day pass by without wee Wullie Rennie jumping up and down shouting something from the back of the hall.

      Delete
    2. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 10, 2015 at 8:02 PM

      Skier, are you at that Holyrood camp with all the other DWP skivers gettin yer Giro delivered just like the Faslane love in shaggers camp.

      Delete
    3. Now Now. Language. Eat your cereal.

      Delete
    4. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 10, 2015 at 9:31 PM

      Baaahhh.

      Delete
    5. GWC----You may very well hail from Glasgow. You may even be working but class is something you are sadly lacking

      Delete
    6. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 10, 2015 at 11:14 PM

      You are probably Nat si Tartan Tory middle class. No time for working people just pariahs that feed of us. And you are not funny. Try again.

      Delete
  35. How do you tell if you are a dalek's sphincter? Troll this site.

    Pair of nads, they are.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Glasgow Working ClassDecember 10, 2015 at 7:17 PM

      Anon, you are the anus and probably so tight there is no chance of reaching your sphincter.

      Delete
    2. Eat your cereal like a good wee boy now there there (pat on head)

      Delete