Monday, September 14, 2015

Why does the new Labour leader think Scotland is a lesser nation than Ireland?

A second quick note of the day, this time to let you know I have a new article at the International Business Times, about Jeremy Corbyn's double-standard on the national questions in Scotland and Ireland.  You can read it HERE.


  1. The majority of Irish people want independence, the majority of Scottish people dont

    1. Then you'll have to explain the recent TNS and Ipsos-Mori polls, both of which showed that a clear majority of Scottish people do want independence.

    2. Corbyn supported the Unification movement when the majority in Northern Ireland did not (and do not) support it.
      Never let it be said that Jeremy has ever believed that just because he is in a minority position that he is necessarily wrong.
      The point being made is that if his desire for Irish reunification is on the (perfectly legitimate) grounds that colonialism is always wrong then why is it not wrong in the case of Scotland if it is 'the principle' which matters and not the numbers?

    3. Average of latest 5 polls from 5 different pollsters suggests they do.

    4. The history of Ireland is very different to that of Scotland. Ireland was Catholic and oppressed by Protestant Britain - Scotland being the most fanatically Protestant part of Britain. All this is obviously water under the bridge long ago. We are all atheists / agnostics now. But it's important to understand the historical issues.

      Three polls in three days - YouGov, Panelbase, and now Survation - all showing a NO lead. A referendum a year ago sampling 3 and a half million people - 55% No. You guys are really clutching at straws.

    5. Mr anonymous, apparently you are wrong.

  2. Thanks for the link.

    There seems to be a meme that allows staunch (Scottish) Unionists to get misty eyed about Ireland but, heaven forfend, not Scotland. I may be wrong, but Michael Kelly of this parish appears to be the living exemplar of that philosophy. Your example, my brain has edited his name out of my conciousness - oh, ok, George Galloway - is a one dimensional bigot. He has little respect for either the tolerant generality of Scottish life, as lived, nor the genuinely corrupt way we treat refugees who, lest we forget, were fleeing death. It always astonishes me that refugees are treated as second class citizens. As if the granting of citizenship of a corrupt state is somehow a kindness that only the State can bestow.

    People, local to Knightswood and Manchester are much better human beings than Westminster mandarins.

    1. Glasgow Working ClassSeptember 14, 2015 at 8:30 PM

      George Galloway did do the best tour of Scotland arguing for the Union. He was right about the lowering of corporation tax and dragging down wages to suit the corporations. No wonder wee Alec would not debate with him. I attended his meeting in Glasgow and even the intended Nat si hecklers were silenced by his argument. SNP, Tories and Labour all for handing money to the rich. Corbyn will not upset big business.

    2. Galloway is a plastic socialist who will run for mayor of london. He's bound by his benefits to defend the union in any way he could. He knew as well as anyone else that there is a difference between setting corporation tax and actually collecting it, which is what was the intention had we voted yes. As for dragging wages down, the SNP were the first to introduce a living wage, so quite to the contrary, again, the intention was to ensure a more equitable income distribution in Scotland.

  3. Maybe Jeremy Corbyn truly does believe that "Scotland certainly was extinguished as a matter of international law, by merger either into an enlarged and renamed England or into an entirely new state".

    Maybe he sees Ireland's representative at the UN and thinks they are more serious about being a country?

  4. It is entirely possible that Corbyn is geographically challenged and mistakes Scotland for Wales.

  5. It is also entirely possible that like many in the South of England Corbyn is profoundly ignorant of the reality of Scotland, the always separate legal system, police, education, NHS etc. etc and has never attended a Scottish Grand Committee and basically stopped paying attention at all after Devolution.

    Or it might just be that since we have never* taken up arms in favour of our independence he not only doesn't think we are serious about it but we don't have any terrorists to cuddle up to.

    *The SLA were not serious and much of it was an MI6/Police provocation.

  6. The obvious hypocrisy and double-standard is undoubtedly going to be a problem for Corbyn and the Britnats.

    However, likely not quite as big a problem for Corbyn as when some of SLAB's 'finest' react to Corbyn and most notably McDonnell's desire for Irish reunification. True, many of the most egregious of the orange order poster boys have been swept away after May, but by no means all.

    To be fair Watson knows full well where the danger lies and you can bet he's told Corbyn all about the 'fun and games' in SLAB (like that surrounding Falkirk) and also who in and around SLAB can be relied on to move against Corbyn soon enough.

    No doubt that's also why Corbyn has scheduled a meeting with the current branch office manager Dugdale and why Dugdale has been told by the ABC's and hangers on in SLAB to react in such an amusing manner. - 'I am in charge!!' etc.- LOL Course you are Kez, course you are. ;-)

    Truth is though that Corbyn has even less chance of keeping control of the more lunatic Blairites and assorted SLAB Orangemen than little Ed did. As funny as the exodus of the Blairites was (which we all knew was coming on this blog) it does mean that the infighting and backstabbing will be a constant factor from now on with Labour party chaos never far from the surface when it isn't just out in the open.

    There's plenty more chaos to come of course with the inevitable nasty party split and chaos over Europe to look forward to but for the meantime this will do nicely. (and now that Labour has chosen it's leader some of the tory Eurosceptics who were clearly holding back might just decide it's time they found out precisely where Cameron's out of touch chumocracy stand on the official tory policy being pro-Europe and pro-EU immigration from here on in.)

    That could prove even more hilarious than even today's poll showing the tories down two and labour up one after weeks of barking mad, foaming at the mouth, right wing tabloid hysteria about Corbyn.

    There are few things more laugh out loud funny than the bizarre and utterly outdated notion by the most stupid of the Westminster bubble twits that the low I.Q. right wing papers and their shrieking hysteria are somehow even close to being the arbiters of public opinion in 2015.

    Though if we're being honest the BBC's westminster bubble coverage of Corbyn has also been priceless and the stuff of Fox News. Now the BBC look set to alienate a few hundred thousand Labour supporters in from now on. Labour voters and supporters who might just tell them and their BBC poll tax to fuck right off as so many scots did here after their comically biased referendum coverage. Good move chaps! :D

    1. Mick, Labour gained another 15,000 new members in the last day or so, so their membership must be fairly close to 600,000 in the UK now. The BBC, like the good old corrupt establishment broadcaster it is, is going to piss off in a major way these members by acting as the Tories Pretorian Guard. There is only so many times you can get away with being as biased as the state broadcaster.

    2. Yesterday the Independent reported 325,000 and rising

  7. James, Wings is tweeting details of a Survation poll.

    1. Ex-DK Y49 N51

      SNP 51 Holyrood cons, Lab 22

    2. 53% SNP On V1

    3. SNP support definitely dropping a bit. Sturgeon paying homage to the Queen, encouraging immigration, criticising Cameron for killing Islamic terrorists, appearing in vogue and banging on about referendums has probably deflated the bubble somewhat. Will that process continue? Will Corbyn deliver a fatal blow?

      What is absolutely clear is that the SNP can't afford to fall much further - the nature of the Holyrood electoral system could deny them a pro independence majority (even with the Greens included) if their combined vote falls to 45%. (Source: Scotland Votes electoral calculator)

  8. The cracks of Corbyn's Labour are already appearing. There is no way Corbyn's Labour will win in England. Voting Labour in Scotland is even more pointless than it already is.

  9. Well, an average of our 5 polls has Yes ahead and that's giving unfair weighing to one method (online).

  10. """ Labour's contingent at Holyrood is now largely blinded by hatred of the SNP, and is far more interested in drawing self-destructive lines in the sand."""

    One of my favourite lines ever and so to the point

  11. Odd, the narrative, even when in the negative is that Scotland is the property of Labour.
    Just truly tired of it.

  12. Now that I've latest poll of polls is showing all parties essentially unchanged within MoE. 2% the max change since the last run of polls. All looking good.

    Constituency VI:
    55% SNP
    22% Lab
    13% Con
    5% Lib
    3% Green
    1% UKIP

    This keeps up and the Tories will get a new record low for Holyrood. That would be embarrassing!

  13. Glasgow Working ClassSeptember 14, 2015 at 8:16 PM

    The Tartan Tories run Holyrood. As I have said before you can fool some of the people some of the time. The rich get richer in Scotland as in England.

  14. To answer the question: because despite all the positives Corbyn is a Brit and Brits only respect violence.

    1. Glasgow Working ClassSeptember 14, 2015 at 9:04 PM

      Alec Salmond said he was British.

    2. @GWC

      "Alec Salmond said he was British."

      I nominate that as your best post yet.

    3. Glasgow Working ClassSeptember 14, 2015 at 11:55 PM

      He said it on the roger melly. It is the truth.

  15. Also from Survation:

    Q24. If there was a referendum tomorrow with the question "Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?", how would you vote?

    51% Remain a member of the European Union
    29% Leave the European

    = 64% Remain ex DK

    Looks fairly standard.

    In big contrast to the 'leave' Survation recently got for the UK.

  16. From Yougov.

    In order of tartan Toryness:

    Some people talk about 'left', 'right' and 'centre' to describe parties
    and politicians. With this in mind, where would you place each of
    the following...?

    Nicola Sturgeon
    53% Left Wing
    12% Centre
    9% Right wing

    Alex Salmond
    45% left wing
    13% Centre
    12% Right wing

    Kezia Dugdale
    36% Left wing
    10% Centre
    15% Right wing

    Ruth Davidson
    4% Left wing
    5% Centre
    57% Right-wing

  17. Glasgow Working ClassSeptember 15, 2015 at 1:34 AM

    Skier. Do you ever go out into the world and meet anyone, women or man, transvestite that type of thing or is it just poll's. I will personally take you out for a beer or three.

  18. Independence shouldn't be seen as a 'reward' for being a more or less 'worthy' nation.