Monday, March 17, 2025

Can anyone imagine the "Rearm Britain" brigade sending troops to fight the Americans if Greenland is invaded?

Even twelve long years after I last posted there, I'm desperately sad to see what's happened to my old haunt of Political Betting, affectionately known as "Stormfront Lite" due to the excessive number of borderline-fascist nutjobs in the comments section.  It's now been completely taken over by "TSE", notorious for once inventing a family tragedy to avoid having to settle a private bet - which I suppose those with a sense of irony would say makes him the ideal man to edit the UK's best-known political betting site.  But it's actually not so much his welching that's the problem, it's the dismal standard of his political analysis and his puerile sense of humour, which I know he honestly thinks adds an "inimitability" to the site but is in reality making it too excruciating to read.  The saving grace is that there are often lengthy, thoughtful guest posts at the weekend, and it might almost be better if TSE just ran those and didn't even try to fill in the gaps in between.  His dreadful weekday posts are absolutely wrecking the site.

I believe he's a Tory member in Manchester or somewhere like that, and like so many clueless Tories south of the border he fancies himself as a bit of an expert on Scotland and Scottish politics.  His latest pronouncement is that Donald Trump's second term has killed Scottish independence stone dead - and he's tried to ward off suggestions that he's guilty of wishful thinking by pointing out that other people have in the past been guilty of wishful thinking on the subject.  But no, I'm afraid this is no more than yet another round of wishful thinking on stilts from a bog-standard Greater England imperialist perspective.

If he was actually immersed as most of us are in what is happening in Scotland, he'd realise that the issue of Trump is a red herring because by far the biggest barrier to independence at present is the SNP leadership's own reluctance to press the issue.  That is not an insurmountable barrier in the long run, but would anyone confidently bet on it being overcome during Trump's four-year term?  Most of us would regard it as an immense luxury if we could start thinking in terms of what external factors might get in the way of an SNP leadership that is seriously trying to win independence in the short-term.  (And any chance of a non-SNP route to independence has been completely ended by the insanely destructive behaviour of the Alba Party elite.)

By the time the independence campaign is fully back on track, it's likely that either there'll be a Democratic president and normal service will have been resumed, or JD Vance will be president, in which case independence will be a moot point because we might all want to take up Musk's offer of emigrating to another planet.

But in any case, TSE is making himself look more than faintly ridiculous by suggesting that campaigning for independence while Trump is president is like trying to do it during the Battle of Britain.  If we're supposed to believe that Trump's trade wars and his threats to invade Greenland are an existential threat on a par with 1940, one that puts an end to politics as usual for the foreseeable future, I'd suggest we'd first need to have a British government that recognises the existence of such a threat.  Instead, Starmer is still sycophantically paying homage to Trump as the leader of a Euro-Atlantic alliance and indeed as someone without whom no way forward in Ukraine is even possible.  If anything, all that does is make Scottish independence look more attractive, because the world order that Starmer is offering is plainly bankrupt.

There's now a Canadian Prime Minister who is using extremely belligerent language and talking of "the Americans" as an aggressor that his country needs to be defended from.  If Starmer was bold enough to verbally "stand with Canada" against the US threat, that might start to change perceptions in Scotland and make people feel that we've moved into an emergency situation which crowds out domestic issues like independence.  But I doubt if there's a single person reading this who can imagine Starmer actually having the guts to do that.  

Britain and other European countries are supposedly rearming so that they can act more independently in future, but does anyone seriously think that Starmer would send troops to fight against the US if there was a border incursion in Canada or a full-scale annexation of Greenland?  Of course he wouldn't.  He'd suddenly rediscover the realpolitik that he's thrown to the wind as far as Ukraine is concerned.  He'd say that a military solution was in the realms of fantasy given America's military strength.  He'd say a dispute between two valued allies was a matter of great regret, and he'd urge a diplomatic solution.  He'd argue that escalation must be avoided at all costs, and he'd suggest that until an amicable agreement can be reached, life wouldn't be so bad for those living under occupation.  After all, the Americans aren't a bad sort, and Donald is a great personal friend of his.

Not exactly the sort of Churchillian rhetoric that will inspire solidarity and put the Scottish independence cause on hold.

54 comments:

  1. Replies
    1. eloquently reposted my mentally impaired, knuckle dragging, red-white & blue bedecked little Englander .... we are all in awe of your political observations.

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    2. Oh dear. Cordelia's back.

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    3. G.W. Cordelia

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    4. Bath Working ClassMarch 18, 2025 at 8:23 PM

      Solidarity, my brother. The workers united will never be defeated.

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  2. Heh. The only saving grace about Trump's insanity is that it's not hard to find ways to flip around "assured" scenarios. For example, all someone has to do is whisper into Trump's ear that Scottish independence is a stepping stone to annexation.

    "Yer maw's homeland could be the 52nd state after Canada! You, Mr President-King, could be Braveheart and bring Freedom to your Motherland."

    I wonder what Starmer would do if THAT happened.

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  3. Correct me if I'm wrong but are you saying that you're not expecting the SNP to make any movement towards independence until some point after 2028/2029?

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    1. We're not in an ideal situation, I haven't made any bones about that. All we can do for now is try to rescue the pro-independence majority next year and build from there - and yes, that does mean "both votes SNP" is the optimum strategy. The non-SNP route to independence is now closed off, and that's the Alba leadership's fault, no-one else's.

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    2. Expect incoming for speaking the truth about Alba. You are in for a rough time. The intellectual prowess of the SNP Baad brigade and their favourite wee dafty IFS is awesome.

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    3. In elections though, don’t you typically vote for a party and its leadership as it exists today, rather than what you hope it might become in the future?

      When a party performs well in an election, it usually takes that as confirmation that voters support its current policies and direction. Few parties interpret electoral success as a signal that they need to change or rethink their approach.

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    4. Yes, they do. They do it all the time. The SNP were elected in 2021 on a promise to hold an independence referendum, then junked the policy.

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    5. Because they've done things like that, it's a tall order to ask people to trust them again, especially when your position essentially boils down to just crossing your fingers.

      Doesn't that kind of prove the original point? If they can keep winning elections while breaking promises, why would they ever change?

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    6. You can't have it both ways. You've argued that political parties see re-election as an endorsement of their current stance and therefore don't deviate from it. I've just given you an example where the opposite was true. There are plenty of others.

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    7. But that’s exactly the problem. The SNP didn’t abandon their promise because voters forced them to change course, they did it because they knew they could win without delivering.

      That proves the original point: as long as people keep voting for them regardless, they have no reason to follow through on their commitments.

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    8. "The SNP didn’t abandon their promise because voters forced them to change course"

      You're trying hard here, but I think you do realise you've contradicted your original point. Parties do often change course after being elected.

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    9. Anon lowlife troll at 8.39pm. Get yourself a hobby that disnae involve trolling me it will improve your mental health. Your obsession with me is disturbing and abnormal. I can only assume you had a difficult childhood.

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    10. How many fake names do you have IFS?

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    11. On the matter of a party making electoral promises then changing tack and not delivering, circumstances, events and reality can get in the way. You cannot, for example, just airbrush covid and its aftermath, the prosecution of A S and the ongoing police investigation against N S out of history. And they all impacted, in the real world, on progress towards Independence. In this bubble people can speculate, pretend and fulminate. In the real world any form of electoral process with a view to claiming Independence is fraught with difficulties, legal and otherwise. Vote share is stubbornly staying in or around 50%. The purpose and complexity of the process started by N S in the application to the S C is still not understood. The police investigation successfully hounded her out of politics. There was no shortage of support from a faction within the Indy movement for the police action, support that at times was shamefully gleeful. There is no simple process towards Indy. The next step has to be what we are referring to as a de facto referendum. If a pro Indy majority can be secured, we then need to move on to a combination of confrontation with Westminster and application for International recognition as an Independent country. Both will be difficult processes. I do not see the strong leadership to lead us through this. The 2026 Holyrood election is pivotal. At present it is going to be the point at which the Indy movement is stalled for at least two terms to regroup and reshape. J S, in many ways a great servant to the cause of Independence, shows no sign of galvanising Indy supporters and securing the majority we need. I great the worst.

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    12. Final sentence of post immediately above should read I fear the worst.

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    13. Anon @ 6:17

      You're forgetting though the rhetoric that was used prior to those events you've listed.

      For example for the 2017 General Election the rhetoric at the time was: Last year’s Holyrood election (2016) delivered the democratic mandate for an independence referendum.

      “The recent vote of Scotland’s national parliament has underlined that mandate. If the SNP wins a majority of Scottish seats in this election (2017), that would complete a triple lock, further reinforcing the democratic mandate which already exists.

      The frustration was that everyone knew Westminster wouldn't allow another referendum but each and every election was portrayed as the one where they would 'succumb to the democratic pressure' and all we needed to do was vote SNP. It's why people started using the term carrot dangling.

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    14. Anon at 6.48. The rhetoric compared to the reality is in part kind of the point, and the reality is that every day there are changes and developments. I have outlined the way forward. I’m not really interested in looking back. People can embrace or reject my outline. It is the only way.

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    15. Issue is though 2021 and 2024 was then also essentially the same strategy (2024 was worded in a different way but if you looked at the details & what leading figures were saying it was basically the same).

      Today there's no new plan on the table and the rhetoric being used is that we need to maintain a pro-indy majority just for it's own sake. Have a pro-indy Government in name only & there being odd bewilderment as to why that might not be enough for many to support.

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    16. Anon at 12.49am - none - how many do you have?

      6.17am - you look to the future and learn from the past. I have no time for apologists ( you) for the unionists leading the SNP.

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  4. So how do “you press for independence”?

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    1. Make sure the iron is full and set to the linen setting.

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    2. By wishing it into existence. We're beyond discussing anything tangible, we've moved onto 'hope for the best'.

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    3. But that’s more or less the last remaining argument for voting SNP: keep them in power and just hope something happens at some undefined point in the future.

      We’ve stopped discussing how the 2026 election could actually move us closer to independence or what will make things different after 2026 compared to what's happened since 2021.

      There’s no inspirational plan to rally behind, just a negative campaign based on fear of unionists getting in.

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    4. Please stop trying to put words in my mouth, it's not going to work. Of course we're discussing how the 2026 election can bring independence closer, that's exactly what we're doing. The retention of a pro-independence majority is an absolutely essential step towards making any progress. If you think there's some sort of road to independence that involves a unionist majority at Holyrood, by all means explain your thinking - but you're going to struggle.

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    5. Lord of the SlippersMarch 18, 2025 at 6:05 AM

      You say it's an absolutely essential step, James but I think that's overstating it. On the evidence of the last four years the SNP's efforts towards independence are negligible and there is no indication from anybody that will change.
      On that basis (and that is why I will abstain), there is no difference between securing an Indy majority next year or not.
      We can focus on building more support for Yes but the political vehicle has failed us.

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    6. A unionist majority at the Holyrood election will result in the policies currently being implemented in England, including in devolved areas, being implemented in Scotland. Personally, I cannot facilitate attacks on the disabled, the poor and the vulnerable, support for a genocidal regime, and more generally support for a system that is systemically corrupt and designed to maintain the status quo and protect the rich, including the disgraceful monarchy and all it stands for. Each to their own. In the hard real world, SNP or Unionist governments in Holyrood still have to govern. I know which I prefer. I will vote accordingly. Abstaining amounts to support for unionist rule in Scotland. That is the difficult reality.

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    7. Anon at 6.52. You confuse the quest for Indy with the reality of the need for day to day governance. In day to day governance I do not want the policies of the right wing unionist parties. I vote accordingly.

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    8. The issue with focusing on day-to-day governance though is that few people are looking around and thinking to themselves that things are great.

      Day-to-day governance is what led to the drop in the polls from the 47.7% the SNP achieved in the polls to the 30% range they're stuck in now. Their only saving grace is how shit Labour has been at Westminster and Reform UK coming along splitting the vote.

      But asking people to go to the ballot box to vote for the least worst option on the ballot paper also isn't a motivating strategy. If people feel like nothing ever changes regardless they'll stop bothering and are so fed up will just tune out any negative campaigning as that will just make them more sick of the process "All they ever do is attack each other" etc.

      Unless something changes I can easily see apathy being the winner in 2026.

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    9. "You say it's an absolutely essential step, James but I think that's overstating it"

      Then go ahead - explain how electing a unionist majority can bring about independence. I've read your comment with care and I see no such explanation.

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    10. Anon at 7.35. The biggest factor for people I speak with is the lack of priority afforded to Independence. Change that and it is game on in 2026. My choice is based on the politics of the various parties. It is nothing to do with the tories and labour being thieving incompetents. It is nothing to do with SNP being the least crap option. That is a variation on a Daily Mail trope. It is to do with unionists being right wing and deeply unpleasant people with appalling policies. I am not asking people to vote based on SNP being least crap. But the consequences of facilitating unionist govt in Scotland are truly dreadful. I will vote accordingly. Each to their own.

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    11. Lord of the SlippersMarch 18, 2025 at 11:53 AM

      James. In exactly the same way that letting in a huge Labour majority at WM did last July. They have done exactly what I predicted they would do. Screwed everything up and make Indy for Scotland look an even better prospect. Even I didn't think they'd be this bad after nine months though!
      A Unionist majority at HR, achieved through disillusioned SNP voters sitting on their hands, will force the SNP to properly reform and refocus in opposition while Labour (presumably) make a fantastic case for independence every day of their inevitably incompetent five year term. If we're really lucky the unwanted blue hair contingent will all jump ship back to their traditional home of Labour too. The alternative is another five years of guaranteed insipid, luke warm indifference on indy by the same old SNP crowd.
      Sometimes in life you have to withdraw, regroup and return with superior fire power.

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    12. It's an interesting point, the argument being able is essentially: We can't let the unionists in! Once they're in they'll do such a good job the electorate will keep re-electing them.

      The discussion then tends to turn to batshit crazy notions like they'll close Holyrood.

      A lot of the things that get mentioned are basically just our version of project fear, but in reality it's likely most of it will be unfounded and we'd just have an incompetent Government for 5 years (which tbh wouldn't be largely different from the one we've had since 2021).

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    13. "In exactly the same way that letting in a huge Labour majority at WM did last July. They have done exactly what I predicted they would do. Screwed everything up and make Indy for Scotland look an even better prospect."

      I'm sorry but that makes zero sense. There would have been a Labour government regardless of how Scotland had voted. We self-evidently would be in a stronger position if there were 30, 40 or 50 pro-indy MPs at Westminster to oppose the Labour government.

      Anon at 12.58: Now address the question: how would electing a unionist government *help*? You've posted and posted and posted and I still haven't seen you answer that question.

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    14. Lord of the slippers argument is pretty astonishing. Both tories and labour want to weaken devolution with a view to Holyrood becoming nothing more than regional govt constrained by Westminster. It’s naivety to think otherwise. They have actually told us to our faces they intend doing it. A unionist majority in 2026 and Indy is completely screwed for at least the next two terms of parliament.

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    15. Lord of the SlippersMarch 18, 2025 at 2:52 PM

      I guess that's where we'll leave it, James. I simply don't believe 40+ MPs would be helping us achieve Indy right now (although the £1M of short money might have done if the will had been there). I base this opinion on the performance of SNP MPs since 2015. I won't lose any sleep over an SNP defeat at HR26. It's how strongly they come back that's important. All the best, James.

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    16. "A unionist majority in 2026 and Indy is completely screwed for at least the next two terms of parliament."

      Compared to the tremendous progress made over the last two terms of Parliament?

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    17. I'm guessing where Lord of the Slippers is coming from is that its typically electoral defeat that leads to a Political Party to self reflect, determine why they've lost support, implement major internal reforms and then come back stronger to fight the next election.

      The SNP has been in power for so long now that they're suffering from political fatigue. They have become more about maintaining the status quo rather than driving new initiatives. They've grown complacent, relying on past achievements rather than pushing for innovation. But as long as they keep winning elections, there's little motivation to change or do anything differently—like flogging a dead horse and expecting it to gallop again.

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    18. "All the best, James."

      That randomly sounds very final. Adieu, auf wiedersehen, fare thee well.

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  5. I think you will find that Trump threatened to attempt to buy Greenland, not invade it. I think he should buy Blackpool.

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    1. Nope, that was in his previous term. Now it's "one way or another, we're going to get it".

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  6. “ by far the biggest barrier to independence at present is the SNP leadership’s own reluctance to press the issue.” I agree.

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  7. Losing Scotland will be a major blow to an already pretty much knackered UK. They wont let us go easily. It wont be done by agreement as it just barely might have been in 2014.

    We need a parliamentary majority at Holyrood, with the target of independence prestated, in order to have democratic legitimacy. We're also going to need at least tacit co-operation between the SNP that gains the majority and the groups that are engaged with the currency, constitutional and other work that will enable keys steps towards establishing our new sovereignty. It will be a gradually accumulating disengagement not a single moment.

    All of this will be hard and surrounded by screams of 'illegality' and 'disloyalty/ betrayal'. That is why Swinney, Forbes et al are unlikely to be the leaders. They are suits with salaries first and last.

    We have to fight for elected member accountability in the SNP, build our political alliances and understand how difficult a peaceful but determined campaign is going to be.

    Timescales will be unpredictable and are best not attempted. We are starting from a pretty low point due to the habits of troughing and self destruction among our various groups of alleged leaders.

    Concentration on the tasks is the way forward. I'm old, I don't expect to see the fully formed outcome. Being firmly on the road would do for me.

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  8. England will never let us go as you say. They have the mindset that they own us and some Scots become they are and sook up to them like Mone, Sarwar, Baillie ( born abroad) Findlay and the rest. This includes footballers eg McCoist, athletes draped in the butchers apron, senior church men and women and those with a twisted view of history eg folk from Larkhall!

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    1. Embarrassing bullshit from a Nat numpty.

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    2. Let’s not forget our very own SGP House Jock KC.

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  9. As a relative newcomer to SGP, I don’t understand this KC thing!
    Who is “KC”? Maybe James or somebody else could explain for me.

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    1. What is the relationship between KC and GWC?

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