tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post2119192897729230638..comments2024-03-29T16:01:04.854+00:00Comments on SCOT goes POP!: Daisley, the neocon link list, and the 1967 "liberation" of East JerusalemJames Kellyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01516007141763230886noreply@blogger.comBlogger90125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-9555163942521513932015-08-26T14:03:07.461+01:002015-08-26T14:03:07.461+01:00Coming back to the Scotsman newspaper topic:
Doug...Coming back to the Scotsman newspaper topic:<br /><br />Douglas Fraser @BBCDouglasF 3 mins3 minutes ago<br />Scots newspaper sales Jan-Jun down ave 10+% on last year. Biggest faller @scotonsunday -20% to 24k. Pro-'yes' Sunday Herald: +15.5% to 29k<br />Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-39965850343196362282015-08-26T13:51:11.695+01:002015-08-26T13:51:11.695+01:00It's you that talked about 'blood Scots...It's you that talked about 'blood Scots' what ever that is in your mind. I only mentioned country of birth and self national identification (which generally correlate strongly globally); something academics and pollsters have been looking at.<br /><br />Maybe you could elaborate as to what you feel a 'blood scot' is?<br /><br />Would I qualify? I'm 1/4 Irish on my mother's side. What about my daughter? She's half French. Does she qualify as 'Blood British' too incidentally?<br /><br />And you can know how people voted. You ask them. Given different pollsters are asking different 1000 standard samples and getting the same answers, we can conclude there's something to this.<br /><br />And it's hardly a surprise that people born in Scotland might be more likely to see themselves as Scottish and vote Yes as a result. Jeez, if Scotland was strongly British in identity rather than Scottish, we wouldn't be debating the topic of independence.<br /><br />Note the referendum study I've been talking about had a sample size of 5000 which gives an MoE of 1.4%.<br /><br />Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-76159782133391307622015-08-26T13:34:59.243+01:002015-08-26T13:34:59.243+01:00There is nothing wrong with identifying with a par...There is nothing wrong with identifying with a particular nation. I'm just saying there is an unhealthy focus amongst some nationalists on what polls say about how "blood Scots" did vote / would vote. We are all in this together (to borrow that over used expression) and everyone will have their own reasons for voting the way they did. We can't possibly know how they voted anyway - as it was a secret ballot.<br /><br />Aldo Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-34952151059311673882015-08-26T12:31:55.935+01:002015-08-26T12:31:55.935+01:00If you vote to remain in the union, then you are v...If you vote to remain in the union, then you are voting for the right to moan about the UK government / what English, Welsh and N. Irish people choose for this as well as Scottish. I was responding to Glasgow's weird logic which says the opposite.<br /><br />If you vote for indy, then you are voting for the right to moan about a Scottish government only and the choice of Scottish people.<br /><br />Given democracy is all about voting for the government you want regularly over the government you don't, it goes without saying moaning about the latter is an everyday part of it.<br /><br />--<br /><br />We are talking about Scottish polling. It was very accurate in the May GE. Here is the PoP from WST based averages:<br /><br />http://blog.whatscotlandthinks.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Slide12.jpg<br /><br />I'm not sure that could have been more accurate!<br /><br />Are you saying researchers at the university of Essex are 'overly focussed' on talking about where people came from in relation to how they voted? They were a partner in the study I'm talking about.<br /><br />I suspect they were just looking for the most important factor in every independence referendum; which country people primarily identify with, whatever their origins. Incidentally, a ~1/4 of English people identified with Scotland as a country and voted for that. I know some; call themselves 'English Scots' just as my wife is 'French Scots'. I see nothing wrong with that as you seem to be implying there is.Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-83384426364883229782015-08-26T12:23:42.684+01:002015-08-26T12:23:42.684+01:00Looks like you are getting targeted by the Brit Na...Looks like you are getting targeted by the Brit Nat bigots and trolls.James I guess they must be upset at the collapsing Stock Exchanges and their vanishing Pension Funds. Oh that's right - something that was only meant to happen if Scotland voted Yes, oh dear! KARMA IS A !!!!!Iain Morenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-33322215884961256842015-08-26T11:54:54.548+01:002015-08-26T11:54:54.548+01:00For someone who believes in civic nationalism you ...For someone who believes in civic nationalism you sure do enjoy picking apart who voted for whom and where they come from. If English people did vote no then I doubt they did it so they could continue to have whingeing rights re the British government. If Scottish people voted Yes then I equally doubt that their motivation was so that they could only blame themselves if anything went wrong.<br /><br />The polling for the GE was a disaster. They predicted Labour 34, Tories 33. In reality, the tories were about 6-7 points clear.<br /><br />So polling can be wrong. It has the potential to miss certain things, particularly if respondents are a bit embarrassed about certain beliefs of theirs. <br /><br />All we know for sure about the indyref is that a majority of people in Scotland said 'no'. Trying to break it down beyond that is conjecture - and pointless if you are a civic nationalist. <br /><br />AldoAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-87747576308785860962015-08-26T11:42:13.742+01:002015-08-26T11:42:13.742+01:00Glasgow Working Class says they "leave tae go...Glasgow Working Class says they "leave tae go tae England or elsewhere. Not surprising as hypocrisy is established in the younger. They go away for a better life to pay less tax..."<br /><br />Oh really? Scots are moving to England to pay less tax? Are you sure that England has a lower rate of tax than Scotland? Are you not confusing England with la la land in your imagination?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-40449444151062721232015-08-26T11:31:09.062+01:002015-08-26T11:31:09.062+01:00I don't see how my point raises any questions ...I don't see how my point raises any questions about civic nationalism. All people living in Scotland were given a choice. These people also freely choose their national identities. That is civic nationalism. If the Scottish Government had excluded English migrants from the iref franchise - just like the UK government plan to exclude my wife from the EU ref - you'd have a point as it would be moving into ethnic nationalism.<br /><br />All I stated was that studies show that people born in England and living in Scotland were much more likely to opt to remain 'British' so they could complain about Westminster / the government people has elected in England not running Scotland well. In contrast, people born in Scotland opted in majority to be 'Scottish' by backing independence, so allowing Scotland to take responsibility for its own problems.<br /><br />Polling for the GE was absolutely bang on - got SNP, Lab...Con..Lib levels to within 1% or so on average - on so I've no idea what you mean here.Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-52719248137381545972015-08-26T10:07:18.451+01:002015-08-26T10:07:18.451+01:00Civic nationalism is blind to your point of origin...Civic nationalism is blind to your point of origin though - or is supposed to be, at least. Everyone's view counts the same - whether you're English, Scots - or whether you landed here on a plane from China just last week.<br /><br />Also, a reality check. 3.6 million people voted in the indyref. It was a secret ballot. Nobody knows for sure who voted for what. All we have is a few polls sampling on average about 1000 people each. That's nothing in the grand scheme of things. I understand that the correct mix in a polling sample should, in theory, allow us to make accurate conclusions. But just look at what happened in the general election.<br /><br />Aldo Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-73958705194434177952015-08-26T07:26:54.989+01:002015-08-26T07:26:54.989+01:00'Scots' (Scottish Born) voted Yes; English...'Scots' (Scottish Born) voted Yes; English (born) voted No. By GWC's logic, that means <i>English</i> people prefer to keep on blaming Westminster / those down south for any problems in Scotland. In contrast, Scots (born) wish to blame nobody but themselves in majority.Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-4966899215573650412015-08-26T07:23:48.070+01:002015-08-26T07:23:48.070+01:00I thought 'mass immigration' fuelled suppo...I thought 'mass immigration' fuelled support for 'independence'?<br /><br />It's what Farage and co bang on about all the time / what's behind the EUref thing is it not?Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-33085246498004969092015-08-26T07:15:45.379+01:002015-08-26T07:15:45.379+01:00You need to look at all polling. MoE is way to big...You need to look at all polling. MoE is way to big on individual cross-breaks. A single poll was what got No Thanks all worried in the iref.<br />Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-20562945568410155952015-08-26T00:43:07.839+01:002015-08-26T00:43:07.839+01:00Had a look at the survation tables Scottish Skier....Had a look at the survation tables Scottish Skier.<br /><br />16-34: Roughly 60-40 YES<br />35-54: Roughly 51-49 YES<br />55+: Roughly 65-35 NO<br /><br />It doesn't QUITE match the picture you've painted, does it? Huge majority of the 55+. Middle agers a virtual dead heat with all to play for. Younguns look like a lost cause but aren't totally beyond reach. Plus a lot of those people will get jobs, mortgages, cars and pensions and vote "no" in later life.<br /><br />You know, you actually had me worried for a minute. I might've known it would be all spin and no substance. <br /><br />Couldn't find the Panelbase one.Aldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03385445471036440872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-81695689806505568732015-08-25T23:59:23.519+01:002015-08-25T23:59:23.519+01:00Why does putting the name of a football team in in...Why does putting the name of a football team in inverted commas make you a bigot?Niallnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-47845787359872697002015-08-25T23:56:44.022+01:002015-08-25T23:56:44.022+01:00I did find it astounding that a clear majority of ...I did find it astounding that a clear majority of 16-24s were in favour of union. It reaffirmed my faith in the yoof, that's for sure.<br /><br />As for my fellow millennials, I am shocked. You have memories of the cold war, you witnessed 9/11 and the international banking failure. Yet you still think smaller is better, safer? <br /><br />Go sit in the corner.Aldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03385445471036440872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-48272584761638827752015-08-25T23:45:55.904+01:002015-08-25T23:45:55.904+01:00James Stewart was descended from the first Tudor K...James Stewart was descended from the first Tudor King, Henry VII and was the son of the cousin of Queen Elizabeth I. His great uncle was the infamous King Henry VIII of England.<br /><br />It makes you wonder - for just how long were Scotland and England ruled by members of the same family, with our occasional wars and spats being the result of what was, basically, a family falling out?<br /><br />Aldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03385445471036440872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-63936212815640304042015-08-25T23:44:55.097+01:002015-08-25T23:44:55.097+01:00Yes trial by Daily Mail - yes that same Daily Mail...Yes trial by Daily Mail - yes that same Daily Mail that supported Hitler in the 1930s and is still owned by the same family trust ....Steve Bnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-55957964553338783822015-08-25T23:36:48.570+01:002015-08-25T23:36:48.570+01:0025 tae 39ns, thats the wans that leave tae go tae ...25 tae 39ns, thats the wans that leave tae go tae England or elsewhere. Not surprising as hypocrisy is established in the younger. They go away for a better life to pay less tax but want the rest to stay at home while they sing hard done tae songs aboot Scotland. Just like the Irish, lets blame England.Glasgow Working Classnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-19444722476705300672015-08-25T23:27:53.775+01:002015-08-25T23:27:53.775+01:00Ah, so now its the under 55s....
You were telling...Ah, so now its the under 55s....<br /><br />You were telling me yesterday you would have to go into a bowling green or old folks nursing home to find a unionist majority. 55 and up isn't exactly ancient these days Scottish Skier - and a 55 year old could conceivably live another 40 years. Certainly 20, if they play their cards right. <br /><br />Then you have the problem of peoples' views changing as they get older. I'm a cynical bastard and I'm only in my thirties. Ten years ago I was a left winger. <br /><br />As you get older and have to work hard, suffer life's knocks and as you accumulate wealth, property and a stake in this country of ours, the less likely you are to rock the boat. That's just a fact of being alive.<br /><br />So, if peoples' views alter as they age, then you have a problem. Scotland has an ageing population. The percentage of old grumps is increasing, not decreasing - and, as immigrants flood in to compensate, they will also bolster the pro union camp. Immigrants don't vote separatist, generally. They prefer the status quo for a variety of very good reasons. Eastern Europeans want the EU and Indians/Pakistanis are known for their admiration of all things British.<br /><br />I cannot see immigration being scaled back in the years to come. England is full and soon there will be an overspill into the Celtic nations. And perhaps that will be the final nail in the coffin not just of Scottish nationalism but also Welsh nationalism and Irish Republicanism too.<br /><br />And with that, I'll bid you goodnight.Aldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03385445471036440872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-71638232962498481652015-08-25T23:26:38.482+01:002015-08-25T23:26:38.482+01:00I do not know if Texas Rangers are bigots. But may...I do not know if Texas Rangers are bigots. But maybe some are.Glasgow Rangers Orange Fellownoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-26259221417086346622015-08-25T23:18:06.042+01:002015-08-25T23:18:06.042+01:00@Brian Powell
Seconded. Scotland (most of it) was...@Brian Powell<br /><br />Seconded. Scotland (most of it) was repelling foreign invaders. It did so successfully until James Stewart got London stars in his eyes and then a parcel of rogues sold us down the river for some baubles. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-3756109311503293732015-08-25T23:06:34.652+01:002015-08-25T23:06:34.652+01:00"you would think more nationalists would buy ..."you would think more nationalists would buy it - support the cause."<br /><br />They purchase an online subscription, like me. It's not last gasp funded by click bait advertising like the failing Scotsman. The National makes money. <br /><br />Shit man, as a Tory, can't you see the business potential when half the population back indy? The pro-union press is overcrowded with ailing titles. With indy, there's a market.Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-69487882516223723992015-08-25T23:00:39.354+01:002015-08-25T23:00:39.354+01:00Looks like we wont have to wait for the split. It&...Looks like we wont have to wait for the split. It's underway already. A new party, the Scottish Left Project, is to run for Holyrood on a platform of indy+socialism. So that's 3 ways the pro indy vote can go - SNP, Greens or SLP. Could be problematic if the SNP, due to its governmental responsibilities, comes to be seen as 'too moderate' on the issue of independence.<br /><br />I wonder why all Scottish pro indy parties are left wing? It's always about socialism. We are a country of 5 million people. Are we defined by socialism so much that its all our nationalist parties can talk about?<br /><br />Just once I'd like to see a Scottish indy movement determined to leave not just the UK but also the EU and recast Scottish society according to the teachings of Adam Smith. I could never vote for it - but it would be good for a laugh and would mean Scotland, from a political perspective, is more than just a one trick pony.Aldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03385445471036440872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-67544835327085818552015-08-25T23:00:34.405+01:002015-08-25T23:00:34.405+01:00In the latest poll, Yes gets a majority in the und...In the latest poll, Yes gets a majority in the under 55's comfortably; both age group divisions here. From survation too; the pollster that called the iref bang on. They don't provide more detailed breakdowns, only 3 groupings. However, if you look at other polls in the past with more age splitting and average, only the over ~65's back the union in majority.<br /><br />Latest panelbase shows the same.<br /><br />Tables available online. Just google for them.<br /><br />Polls were done by the British Daily Mail and British Sunday Times for reference.<br />Scottish_Skiernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-930120922627919768.post-48718004287188220372015-08-25T22:40:48.138+01:002015-08-25T22:40:48.138+01:00Wee error in there - only one age group backs indy...Wee error in there - only one age group backs indy - the 25-39s.<br /><br />Aldohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03385445471036440872noreply@blogger.com