Monday, February 10, 2020

No, "consultative referendum" is not a euphemism for "UDI"

I'm rather touched that Peter A Bell keeps posting such flattering photos of me on his blog, but just on a point of clarification, he's wholly wrong to suggest that I've "changed my tune" on Scotland declaring UDI - something which I basically think is a bad idea, although I've always stressed I wouldn't totally rule it out in extreme circumstances where absolutely every other possible remedy has been completely and genuinely exhausted.  Peter is implying that my support for the principle of a consultative referendum is tantamount to support for UDI, but of course it isn't - the point of a consultative referendum would be to reverse the 2014 result, establish a mandate for independence, and use that as leverage to bring the UK government to the negotiating table.  Ideally, the negotiation would be over an independence settlement, but less ideally it could result in a further agreed referendum to put the mandate beyond dispute.

As I understand it, Peter's own position is to passionately advocate for UDI while pretending to oppose it vociferously.  The wheeze is to rebrand UDI as "dissolving the union", and to make out that if you call it that, it somehow becomes an entirely different concept.  But of course any attempt to dissolve the union without Westminster's agreement is by definition a unilateral declaration of independence.  I remain baffled as to what the point of all the semantic game-playing is.

189 comments:

  1. Declarations of independence are by their very nature unilateral.
    UDI is a meaningless and pejorative acronym, the U is superfluous.
    Scotland needs no agreement from Westminster to declare its independence.
    All Scotland need do is demonstrate to the international community of nations that independence is the will of the majority in Scotland.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. "Declarations of independence are by their very nature unilateral."

      Of the many countries that have become independent from London, how many declared UDI? Off the top of my head, I can think of only two: the USA and Rhodesia. In the case of Rhodesia, it was reversed and Britain recolonised the country for a few months before granting legal independence on an agreed basis.

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    2. Waves.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Declaration_of_Independence

      And in the fight that followed, England ran away like the big chickenshit cowardly country it is (hence no section 30).

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    3. What worked in Ireland in 1919 hadn't worked in 1916, the difference being in popular support. Ultimately that is the basis for any move to independence, not in the deployment of weaponry. The real struggle is for "hearts and minds", and always has been. When the time for an idea has come, it is unstoppable. We are on the cusp of that now.

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    4. Absolutely agreed.

      The 'no Section 30' approach is only realistic if Scots still don't actually support independence and by a decent margin. It's still anti-democratic as hell (if Holyrood has backed a vote), but London at least could point at polls and say 'But Scots don't support indy!'.

      That all collapses in the face of majority support for Yes which will, in a good part, be generated by refusal of a Section 30.

      The UK is now in a downward spiral where the increasingly desperate 'blocking' actions of a cowardly, chickenshite, pathetically feeble England, only serve to accelerate the break up of the UK.

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  2. "All Scotland need do is demonstrate to the international community of nations that independence is the will of the majority in Scotland."

    And at that point, its game over for the union.
    Which is why the tories are illegitimately doing all they can to block democracy and deny us our right to self determination.

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  3. Peter's article appears to explicitly endorse UDI, but I do recall a time previously when you had the impression Peter and Craig Murray wanted UDI and Peter got quite cross at the suggestion.

    It reads like he's changed his mind since then, but his point previously was, as you say, semantics.

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  4. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    1. And let's keep on plugging what the Scottish Gov is doing for us that is different from england like free university education.

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  5. England doesn't live in splendid isolation, and neither do we.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/09/sinn-fein-to-try-to-form-ruling-coalition-after-irish-election-success

    Sinn Féin to try to form ruling coalition after Irish election success

    The world is mocking England right now (e.g. Tusk on live TV, cartoons & articles in newspapers) over its pathetic cowardice at being too scared of life without Scotland.

    The jokes will get funnier now, as England needs to ask Sinn Fein for a trade deal. Oh the irony.

    If England had the courage to actually stand on its own two feet (and so respect border polls in Scotland and Ireland), life would be much simpler for it. However, it's own pathetic weak, feebleness / insecurity means it faces trouble ahead, with eventual break-up anyway.

    ..And continued mocking from much braver countries globally, including tiny little Scotland sized ones.

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  6. Section 30 order - BLOCKED by UKGov

    Consultative Referendum - BLOCKED by UK Courts.

    What then? Worth saying again - "What then?"

    If as likely the polls show continuing support for independence then the only route is UDI.

    UDI is very much on the table, in fact it never left the table. It was ignored, pushed to one side to collect dust.

    That has to change. It should be opened up discussion. A plan for implementation should be produced. It should be broadcast around the world. International support should be gathered.

    When Yugoslavia descended into crisis both the US and UK governments warned Slovenia and Croatia not to declare UDI they would not be recognised and crippling sanctions would be imposed. Despite all these threats a few days later both Slovenia and Croatia declared UDI.

    Not being open and honest about the growing prospect of UDI is being dishonest to Scotland.

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    Replies
    1. The answer to "what then?" is a plebiscite election followed by negotiated independence.

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    2. Wooahh! UDI is only worth considering if you have a big majority of people in favour - 60-65% IMO. We are nowehere near that figure, so other approaches have to be taken. For now, at least!

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    3. Bollox to that sort of thinking that Scotland has to wait until some arbitrary figure in future polling before Scots can discuss UDI.

      Preparation, preparation and preparation.

      UDI should be discussed now, proposals formulated, international consultation saught and broad agreement reached.

      Let's make one thing clear, UDI is not a stick to beat the unionists into granting IndyRef2. It is the final.act in ending Westminster rule.

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    4. When the UK 'Supreme' Court rules that indyref2 is illegal, which, of course, it will, at least then we come to the nub i.e. supplication to the only possible arbiter in the matter, the UN and its judiciary the ICJ.

      Supplication to that body can only be taken when it has been demonstrated that all 'local remedies' have been exhausted.

      The UK 'Supreme' Court will refuse to refer an appeal to the ICJ.

      So it will be up to us to make the case in the UN. It needs to be a people group or person, political parties cannot do it.

      You and I have been here before Holebender.

      The other route is epitomized by Kosovo, which declared UDI without even a referendum. Serbia took them to the ICJ expecting to win but lost. Kosovo's UDI being ruled lawful. Kosovo is now on the pending list for EU membership and already de facto members of various EU institutions like the ECB.

      So the UK, having learned from the Kosovo case, will not take a UDU (Unilateral Dissolution of Union), a much stronger case for independence, to the UN/ICJ.

      So unless we bring the case to the UN ourselves, probably the best option, we will be reliant purely on recognition by other countries, especially in the EU if we want to accede to it.


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  7. For sure, it means England = lazy ersed subsidy junkie nation freeloading off Scotland's taxes and too scared to stand on its own two feet, hence no Section 30.

    https://twitter.com/MalcolmChishol1/status/1226571962778050560

    Malcolm Chisholm
    @MalcolmChishol1
    It’s several years since I studied the Block Grant Adjustment but if most of extra money raised in Scotland from higher rate taxpayers is offset by reductions in Block Grant,as Gordon Brewer said
    @BBCScotPolitics
    today,then there’s something far wrong with Block Grant Adjustment.

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  8. Politics is about power.
    Power holders almost never give it up willingly.(Rare exceptions Richard Cromwell & Mikhail Gorbachev).
    The whole history of the Scottish indy movement has been based on the assumption that the 1707 union was voluntary and could therefore be ended by parliamentary democratic means. The biggest difference with Johnson is not that he is an overtly, incoherent, hypocritical, lying arse but that he is quietly pushing the "voluntary" nature of the union aside.
    Like it or not indy is a revolutionary aspiration - but with a movement that never 'signed up' for the implications of that!
    Broadly we either have to wait for an equivalent of Cromwell or Gorbachev in Downing St (odds heavily against), or train ourselves to see that 50% + 1, or even 60% in polls no longer has any magic in it. That doesn't mean that working for more support is pointless by the way.
    The way to do that is to work through every democratic possibility and draw the conclusions out when the lardy narcissist says, no.
    Either the SNP leadership has lost direction or that's what they're doing. They probably don't know which themselves.
    We are in critical times. Indy is an historical process. History is messy. What's needed is a strategy - there ain't no such thing as a 'blueprint' !

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  9. Scot goes Pop. Google agreements between Scotland and England before signing the Treaty of the Union of the Parliaments in 1707. These apply to the sovereignty of the Scottish people, and the sovereignty of the English Parliament.

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  10. Scottish politics at the moment is infested by figures furiously advocating all sorts of remedies for problems they don't understand and they're miffed because not enough people in positions of power are paying attention to them so they infect their own dialogue with bitterness about the people they want to listen to them, and they're all online Bloggers insisting everything's wrong but whatever they say, and if the SNP don't dae sumthin then it's because Nicola Sturgeon's too this or too that, and that's when we see the jealous bitterness pour out of them

    Nicola Sturgeon and the SNP have got the job, it's up to them, not some shower of online bitter buggers moaning because they don't like her or because they're male chauvinists and think they're more entitled to louder voices and they're smarter as well

    We all know who they are and we all know their agenda, and folks I promise you, their agenda has nothing to do with Independence, what they want is for people to send them money so they can continue to moan about something they can do nothing about anyway

    These people are not part of the solution, they're part of the problem, and the more you listen to them the more they'll ask you for money so they can keep on keep on moaning

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  11. I remain baffled as to what the point of Peter Bell is these days. A man without a plan, apparently consumed by bitterness, attacking everyone who is anyone in the independence movement.

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    Replies
    1. Big Eater From PerthFebruary 10, 2020 at 10:47 AM

      I am at the table. I have never left the table. Yet I have been pushed to one side.

      Everything is on the table until it is dispatched. My fellow-countrymen and -women require an appetite stimulant.

      Delete
    2. I am a table.
      My neighbour has 7 different types of spoon in her kitchen including a spoonette. But she is not a spoon. I never said that.

      Delete
    3. But does she have spoon long enough to sup wi the NeoNasties?

      Delete
  12. I'm enjoying this morning by looking at the expressions on the faces of N. Irish unionists.

    A picture shall we say.

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    1. You will be claiming to be a God next if you can see a million faces.

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    2. The BBC is showing different examples. Arlene Foster etc.

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    3. I would feel some sympathy if they hadn't tried to use brexit to harden the border in Ireland against the will of the N. Irish people, who voted in a landslide for remain.

      The English backstop betrayal and the Sinn Fein win is their comeuppance.

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  13. Maybe Mrs Foster was thinking about her father who was murdered in front of her by Sinn Fein PIRA. Good memory for a child! And here is you Skier bumming up Sinn Fein.

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    1. The DUP are the political wing of the UDA British terrorist group.

      https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/general-election-2017/dup-chief-arlene-foster-met-uda-boss-days-after-loyalist-murder-in-bangor-35776873.html

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    2. My father was not murdered.

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  14. The English partitioned Northern Ireland and promoted sectarianist bitterness in order to hold it, the English started it to sew division, it's what they've always done throughout the world
    There were killings on the Island of Ireland attributed to either side but were carried out by the English to keep the pot boiling, the Irish have learned that lesson now and are beginning to join together to rid themselves of the English infestation who caused the problems

    And damn good luck to them, take back control Ireland

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  15. What do you think about holding a consultative referendum as part of the 2021 Scottish elections. It won't be boycotted, though some people might refused to answer it. I like it because it saves expense (and thus criticism), and the turnout will be heightened because everyone is going to the polls anyway. It would be like an "extra question" at the same time one is carrying out a normal democratic process.

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    1. Unionist Media BDSM Club -- Closing Soon If We Can't Find Any DomsFebruary 10, 2020 at 3:40 PM

      The Holyrood elections happening on the same day as the indy poll might also blunt London’s Shock and Awe a bit.

      Another possibility opening up is holding the referendum on the same day as the Irish border poll. London would then have to split its Shock and Awe between two fronts. Then we could dare Johnson to respect the result of Ireland's referendum but not ours.

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  16. If the redoubtable Arlene had any sense of history beyond being trapped by it (as you obviously are), she could do worse than copy the example of South Africa's former leader F.W. de Klerk, and in her case reach a rapport with the Irish Republic while she can still extract strategic concessions from it.

    Because Irish reunification is going to happen anyway, it's just a question of how and when. Better to be ahead of the curve than to crash right off it.

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  17. On a scale of 0-10, where 0 = no measurable effect and 10 = earth shattering in terms of Scotland's political / constitutional future, we have the following:

    0 - Derekmackaygate
    7 - Sinn Fein win Irish election

    It could turn out to be an 8-9 yet of course for the Sinn Fein win, but that's not clear right now.

    Certainly, the red saltire will be coming off the union flag very soon it would appear.

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    Replies
    1. What we really need is to hammer home the fact that the Irish are entitled to a vote every seven years. So why not the Scots?

      Time for some creative posters, stickers and other paraphernalia with references to "time zones", "time warps" etc.

      Delete
  18. mr bell would not have anything to say if he didnt have "semantic game-playing".

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  19. Ho ho ho.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/election-2020/2020/0210/1114378-ireland-election-uk/

    UK looks forward to working together with Ireland

    The UK's close relationship with Ireland would continue regardless of the outcome of the election which has seen Sinn Féin emerge as the most popular party in the country, a spokesman for Prime Minister Boris Johnson said.

    "We are of course following the results of the Irish election carefully," the spokesman said.

    "The UK and Ireland are close neighbours and friends and we look forward to continuing to work together."

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  20. James Kelly: "But of course any attempt to dissolve the union without Westminster's agreement is by definition a unilateral declaration of independence."

    The difference, James, is 'UDI' is about a part of a nation seceding from the whole, and that upon that secession the nation state continues to exist sans the seceded territory. That is demonstrably not the case here.

    The United Kingdom of Great Britain is a legal and political entity formed by the Union of two and only two countries – the Kingdom of Scotland and the Kingdom of England (incorporating Wales). It was created by a bilateral internationally recognised treaty. If in any doubt that it was the UK of GB that was formed, please read the Treaty (Acts) of Union, where references to the creation of the UK are abundant.

    It is the case that upon dissolution of the Treaty of Union, its associated enabling acts of parliaments, and any subsequent CONTINGENT intra-state treaties and agreements DERIVED THEREFROM, the United Kingdom of Great Britain will cease to be.

    As you might expect, two and only two successor states will emerge from its discarded husk – the Kingdom of Scotland and the Kingdom of England (incorporating Wales). There can be no continuing state of an extinguished voluntary union of two nations. It is on its face a daft proposition.

    Consider the tautology: When the Union is dissolved, the Union ceases to be.

    Each will inherit the rights and responsibilities of any inter-state treaties entered into collectively on their behalf by the (by then) defunct United Kingdom.

    Each successor state will be heir to their share of the accrued assets of the United Kingdom, and responsible for their share of the liabilities incurred by the United Kingdom during the tenure of their union.

    There will be no UDI because there can be no UDI. 'Dissolve-the-union' and UDI are not synonymous. Scotland's constitutional position is not that of any People or nascent state that separated from the UK. Scotland's constitutional position is sui generis. Scotland will not LEAVE THE UK because Scotland is the co-creator of the UK. Scotland can only dissolve its treaty with England thereby extinguishing the UK. This is a divorce between two parties. The marriage cannot exist once the marriage contract is terminated.

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    1. The current UK was created by the Anglo-Irish Treaty of about 1926. The Anglo-Irish Treaty of about 1926 was based on revising the treaty of union of 1800. I think the 1707 thing is about as relevant as documents about the Austro-Hungarian Empire, and my word there is a lot of obsessive nonsense about it on social media.

      Delete
    2. Aye. Some people think the UK is this 300 year old union when in reality, it's less than a century old. There are people alive older than the UK. It's very far from some ancient state carved in stone.

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  21. You Scottish Nat sis are lamentable. You have lost in Scotland now you turn to a foreign country to get solace. One thing about Sinn Fein is they tolerate no dissent or opinions not to their liking. You get the first bullet in the back of the leg and when you go down the bullet in the neck.

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    Replies
    1. I am thoroughly enjoying your current discomfort with the Irish election outcome.

      Johnson has said he'll work with Sinn Fein as they are England's friends, as per my post above.

      He's preparing for some serious SF feet kissing to get his deal!

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    2. Lamentable? It's you who are really dredging the depths now, with all this verbal violence. Poor old you, it must be bitterly galling to be so on the wrong side of history, and steadily sinking down, down, down...

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    3. There is no wrong or right side of history only history you fake Jock plonker.

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    4. Ah, so now the mask slips and the truth is revealed, you're not even Scottish. So for fakery, you take first place.

      Poor wretched thing, nothing better to do with your life than try in your own pathetically small way on here to resist the tide steadily coming in. Glug, glug, glug...

      Delete
  22. I believe they are doing exactly this.

    https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/comment/sinn-f-in-should-be-thanking-boris-johnson-for-their-election-surge-a4358281.html

    Sinn Féin should be thanking Boris Johnson for their election surge

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  23. Sinn Fein will do to England what England did to Ireland, Mary Lou McDonald will compromise on nothing with Englisher Chancellor Johnson if she gets the chance

    Take back control Ireland and shove it right up them

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    Replies
    1. I thought Irish priests were shoving it right up them or is that another sore subject.

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  24. Congratulations to Sinn Fein and their supporters. The so-called united kingdom continues to disintegrate.

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  25. Westminster 4th July 2018. Claim of right for Scotland was debated on in the chamber. The Speaker closed the debate and asked the people left if they wanted to vote on the motion, it was passed without a vote.

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  26. The Tories, Labour, Liberal and DUP must have been told it would not be legal to vote against the Scottish claim of rights.

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  27. You have to laugh at Herr Johnson when he says "Ireland are our friends" The length and breadth of Ireland babies at their mothers knees are taught what the English British are, Johnson doesn't have enough money to buy a friend in Ireland

    They teach history in Irish schools

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    Replies
    1. Yea Irish Catholic history.

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    2. Aye, and they teach Anglican English history in England.

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    3. Well at least Anglicans eventually accepted religious freedom. When did the Inquisition eventually end or will it!

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  28. Christian Wright in an earlier post is implying that we need dissolve the act of union as opposed to UDI .What is the legal mechanism for this? Does the SG have to have a mandate from its electorate

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    Replies
    1. Ally,

      I'd have thought so.

      If, we, the Scottish electorate were given a straightforward question at, say, the next Hollyrood election:

      "In" or "oot"? Let's leave the consequences aside for a moment.

      If we win that vote the baws on the slates.

      It would be a direct challenge to the idea of what democracy actually is. Assuming we won.

      Is it them or is it us?

      That would be 'interesting' and perhaps a minefield. I don't think we'd be without allies, perhaps many amongst the 'New Commonwealth' though maybe less amongst the 'Old Commonwealth'.

      Delete
    2. UDI is not an option because Scotland is not a region of a state, to agree that Scotland would consider UDI is to admit that Scotland is not a country

      Delete
  29. "James Kelly

    14m

    Ways of telling you're on the Boris Bridge -
    a) You're floating
    b) You hear an underwater explosion"

    Or it could mean that you're "Big Eater" breaking wind in the bath.

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    Replies
    1. Boris knows how to get jockos talking shite. He is a Scottish Nat si in disguise. And Knickerless was over in Brussels offering to suck Barniers Cock. He said wait in the queue.

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    2. You've finally spotted Johnson's real motives.

      Delete
  30. Talk moving to Mary Lou MacDonald being the next Taoiseach.

    Johnson preparing the red carpet for her.

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    Replies
    1. With a name like that she would get the blue carpet at The Grand Old Oprey, Paisley Road Toll.

      Delete
    2. I have a scratched vinyl copy of Tom Devine's Greatest Hits.

      Delete
    3. I have some of Fran and Anna's toenail clippings in a matchbox.

      Delete
    4. So you failed to get the complete set.

      Delete
  31. Knickerless is putting the real Scottish people to shame with her naked grovelling to the EU. She must have a pathological hatred for our English neighbours when she would sell out Scotland to the EU would be Empire. She does not speak for Scotland which she should emphasise to the EU but only the English hating Nat si reactionary mob.

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    Replies
    1. Everyone hates a coward. It's not just Sturgeon.

      England is pathetic. A joke of a nation, so used to freeloading off Scotland it's terrified of having to stand on it's own two feet. Everyone is mocking it internationally for it's pathetic feebleness.

      England needs to quit being the lazy ersed cowardly bully and agree to a Section 30 ASAP if it wants to regain any self respect.

      Delete
    2. Quiet, you stupid racist

      Delete
  32. All sounds very familiar from our chickenshit, cowardly subsidy junkie neighbour.

    https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/britain-stole-45-trillion-india-181206124830851.html

    How Britain stole $45 trillion from India - And lied about it.

    There is a story that is commonly told in Britain that the colonisation of India - as horrible as it may have been - was not of any major economic benefit to Britain itself. If anything, the administration of India was a cost to Britain. So the fact that the empire was sustained for so long - the story goes - was a gesture of Britain's benevolence.

    New research by the renowned economist Utsa Patnaik - just published by Columbia University Press - deals a crushing blow to this narrative. Drawing on nearly two centuries of detailed data on tax and trade, Patnaik calculated that Britain drained a total of nearly $45 trillion from India during the period 1765 to 1938.

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    Replies
    1. Strange how India is in the Commonwealth, its army structure is based on the British Army and both Armies have close ties. Both fight Islamic nutcases. The UK will invite more educated Indians too the UK since brexit. So how more friendly can we get with Indian when Scottish Nat sis want to isolate themselves from their close neighbour most of whom were not around during the Empire.

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  33. I near pished masel at the 'Boris bridge' story on the radio oan the way hame. An engineer fella on tae discuss costs etc was struggling to contain his laughter at times.

    Soon wull hae blue buses drivin aroond promising £350m a day fir oor NHS if we vote fir the onion.

    Or at least if were actually allowed to vote for the union; something Boris has said he won't allow people to do any more (which has the Scots Toris in a flap).

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  34. The difference between Jock and Paddy Catholic Nat sis is Paddy loves bloodlust, martyrdom and a guaranteed place in heaven. Jock just talks about it and is not sure about heaven. Jock is cautious.

    ReplyDelete
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    1. And the English are just plain chickenshit cowards; hence no Section 30.

      Delete
    2. Sure it is not you Nat sis who are chickenshit! Paddy went out and about torturing and murdering Protestants for their Utopian Catholic State and you only have verbal diahorea to offer hiding behind your PC.

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    3. No, I voted Yes, would do so again tomorrow. It's the English who are too cowardly to let people vote.

      Imagine being scared of wee Scotland. England is a pathetic, weak nation right now. Tusk was just mocking it like every country in the world is right.

      Wherever Boris goes, people giggle behind his back about how he's scared of wee Nicola and Scotland. Some just openly mock him, like Tusk.

      WTF else did you think would be the result of him bursting into tears and running away with the baw because lost another election? Did you think people would impressed with such cowardice? Christ, Scotland is 1/10th the size of England. It just looks like a jilted lover having a tiff in the street in front of everyone.

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    4. Give the English the vote if there is another Jocko referendum. You Nat sis are scared of winning.

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    5. It's very clear who the chickenshit wankstains are; those too scared to agree to a referendum.

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    6. The wank stains are from those EU officials and all over the grovelling Knickerless who is intent on selling Scotland to the brothel.

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  35. Seems blogging can be a tough game, sometimes a thankless task.

    Maybe every poster should become a blogger, and we could all go and troll the trolls' blogs.

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  36. Nicola Sturgeons visit to Brussels included talks with Michele Barnier on Scotlands continuing trade with the EU where the FM told Mr Barnier that any trade negotiations with the UK could not include any portion of Scotlands existing trade with the EU as her government in Scotland has legislated for a referendum on Independence and if successful and led to Scotland's Independence would render any deal with the UK meaningless

    Michele Barnier left the meeting for further discussions with EU leaders and Ministers and answered no questions

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    Replies
    1. I am sure Barnier reminded Knickerless that future trade would be with the UK after she got off her knees.

      Delete
  37. I suppose the obvious reason why consultative referendum does not equal UDI is because we may still lose it. And, indeed, the possibility of losing it would be very real, and it should be.

    But that's not a reason not to have one. The point would be to establish that it is not Westminster who gets to say if Scotland wishes to remain part of the United Kingdom. Otherwise, it isn't a union at all.

    -------

    The path to me seems reasonably clear. It's just not clear any longer if the SNP really have the gumption to go for it.

    You ask for a S30 order.
    If not granted, legislate to hold a consultative referendum off your own bat. If WM doesn't like that, fight it in the courts to establish the legality either way.
    If you lose the court battle, you have a plebiscite election where you stand on a mandate for independence itself (and absolutely nothing else in that mandate), not to ask again for an indyref.
    If you win the election then you declare independence. If you lose the election then there's no real reason to confidently think you'd have won a referendum anyway.

    I do think for everyone's benefit the SNP need to show that they have the courage of their convictions of standing for an independent Scotland, and not merely settling for 2nd prize of being competent administrators of a mini parliament to try and prove to everyone that ultimately independence makes sense because it's just a better version of good devolved administration.

    There wasn't anything wrong with trying that approach initially as the SNP have. But they can't expect to be in government in Scotland for 15, 20, 25 years endlessly getting ever more popular whilst slowly but steadily converting folk to independence just by running the budget and legislating well in whatever other areas they have control over.

    It's not realistic, even if it was it might convert some folk to independence but for many others all it would likely do is show folk they have the cake-and-eat-it option of keeping in the union but also having a good anti-Tory or anti-Labour voting option, and in the worst case scenario everyone ultimately gets bored of or pissed off with the other domestic policies and the SNP fall from power anyway. There is a window where popularity of a single party will align with popularity for the broader concept of independence. One does not guarantee the other. The SNP have a shelf-life like all political parties in any power have.

    At some point the SNP either have to accept that they are just trying to be good administrators or they are actually trying to lead a movement to independence. In the short-to-medium term, maybe, but they can't do both over the long-run.

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    1. Very well said. I do think that the SNP have to up the stakes pretty quickly now. Noone can accuse them of opportunism after three years of trying to find a Brexit solution suitable for Scotland. Unsuccessful unfortunately. Indeed the next indy ref may not be won but it has to be held to resolve the issue of 62% of scots voting against Brexit. Nature abhors a vacuum and if the SNP don't start fighting hard, then a new pro-indy party will emerge next year IMO. The warning signs are already there.

      Delete
    2. It shows the lack of self confidence that the Nat sis are using the corrupt EU as an excuse for another referendum. The Nat si should argue their own case.

      Delete
  38. So what benefits in an independent Scotland will the working and lower classes obtain from the Scottish Nat si?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Could be we might remove you and your Orange Lodge head cases the right march around hating people of other colours and religions

      That would be a good start

      Delete
    2. Removing is a Nazi word, kind of like removing the Jews. Not unexpected that a Scottish Nazi would use it. For instance let's remove the English from Scotland.

      Delete
    3. There is nothing wrong with the majority of English people, i have dozens of English friends. Its the useless Government they elect.

      Delete
  39. "Of the many countries that have become independent from London, how many declared UDI?"

    The difference with Scotland is that all of those countries were dominions. Scotland is not a dominion. Scotland IS the Uk.If Scotland walks away the United Kingdom of Great Britain is finished. In other words, the UK of Great Britain exists because Scotland gives it legitimacy to continue existing. Without Scotland, what is left of the UK is the kingdom of England and being equal partners, both have the same right to become the successor state.

    As an equal partner in a voluntary, political union Scotland cannot "UDI", but dissolve unilaterally the voluntary union and it is in its right to do so. Plenty of tory MPs ahave claimed that a state cannot be held against its will in an international treaty. Well, Scotland entered this Treaty of Union as an independent, sovereign state and shall live with the same status.

    I think Peter Bell is right. Asking for independence is falling for the game of the English ruling elite. It fuels the concept that Scotland is an integral part of the kingdom of England, a tiny region over which the kingdom of England holds some kind of ownership. There is nothing tiny about Scotland. Its landmass is 60% that of England, has a longer coastline, holds most natural resources of the UK and some of the biggest deposits of oil and gas in the entire EU.

    What we should be asking and shouting at the top of our lungs is for the revocation of the treaty of union. Because that will not only give us automatic independence but also the legitimate right to claim our ownership share in all assets present on Scotland's territory including territorial waters in line with international law plus a share in all common assets. Pretending we are a colony gives some how legitimacy to the kingdom of England to claim ownership over the resources that are in our own territory. Why should we give our rights on those assets away?

    Somehow and since the Scotland Act 1998 we are being expected to believe Scotland has become a region of the kingdom of England - the plans of federalism by Labour and others aim at the exact same thing, to transform Scotland in a region in paper.

    In my personal and cynical opinion is because the kingdom of England wants to retain all the perks the UK currently has in terms of seats in different places and make a claim in our own territorial assets ie our oil and gas - the McCrone Report already hints at this as it was clear already at the time it was written that the separation of Scotland was very real possibility and the kingdom of England wanted to take that lovely asset that was discovered in Scotland's waters.

    As a matter of fact, the McCrone Report hints at ways in which the Kingdom of England could get hold of "all" the asset, and that includes the change of the territorial boundaries that has already happened under Blair's watch and also the devicing of a way of dividing the asset on the base of population because the kingdom of England holds most of the population.

    They have already been doing this ever since in the form of the barnet formula and by London sucking all the revenues directly and then sending us a portion of the revenues not on the basis of what is extracted from our waters but rather on the basis of our diminished population. Since that oil was discovered, they have been preparing themselves against the dissolution of the union for the last 4 decades and taking as much of our asset as they possibly can. So far they have succeeded.

    I think it is time the Scottish government and MPs started reasserting Scotland's popular sovereignty, powers and rights in this union rather than simply giving them away In agreement with Mr Bell, I also think it is time we stopped asked only for independence and we started demanding instead the end of the union and the recovery of our rights, powers and assets in full.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. But you want to hand Scottish sovereignty to the EU. Your long winded comment above has no credence unless you want an independent Scotland.

      Delete
    2. "But you want to hand Scottish sovereignty to the EU"

      Scotland's popular sovereignty will always lie with the people of Scotland. Yes, I want to see Scotland in the EU. I rather restrict a bit of that sovereignty for the sake of being able to trade with 27 partners, bearing in mind that Scotland will always have control over that sovereignty than having to surrender it all to a cartel of crooks in control of the Kingdom of England and with egos bigger than the EU itself so as to satisfy their delusions of power and the pretence that they own Scotland and its assets.

      "Your long winded comment above has no credence unless you want an independent Scotland"

      You are ineffectively attempting to distract and persuade that independence is what Scotland needs. Independence is only a section of what Scotland needs. Scotland needs to end the union. By doing so it will not only gain independence but it will recover its status as a sovereign state with control over all its territory including territorial waters, all the assets in its territory and its share of the assets of the UK.

      Sorry, you are not fooling me. Scotland is not a colony nor the property of the kingdom of England. Scotland is an equal partner in a voluntary internationalunion and therefore with as much rights as the Kingdom of England to become the successor state.

      Delete
    3. Exactly.

      If 80% of English MPs wanted to revoke the union it would be done and dusted.

      The best avenue left now if to make England decide we are more trouble than we're worth.

      Delete
    4. But as we know, English MPs are chickenshite cowards terrified at the prospect of England having to stand on its own two feet, hence no Section 30.

      Delete
  40. The Chinese authorities are concerned about the Scottish whisky virus that has arrived in China. People are falling over after drinking a bottle of the Amber water and some are sticking the heid Scottish fashion on innocent passing strangers. China will not tolerate outside violence and reserve the right to mass murder our own citizens in our own time. We sympathise with the Scottish Comrades and Auld Lang Mao.

    ReplyDelete
  41. The opinion on Irish reunification is that yes, the Republic would like to see Ireland reunified but, and the big but is that Northern Ireland is by comparison to the Republic extremely poor and to bring the province up to the standard of the Republic would cost billions and the Republican opinion is that it may have to be a slow process as they would have to foot the bill for it

    Mary Lou McDonald said Scotland is in a different position to Northern Ireland because they already have a great deal of wealth potential as a result of smart SNP devolved government over the last ten years bringing Scotland up to EU standards while Northern Ireland as a province of the UK has remained poor under the British government

    ReplyDelete
  42. Ding dong Bell, Pussy's in the Well.
    Deng Shou Ping, Pussy's got a Ring.

    ReplyDelete
  43. As an aside, how might the Irish results have differed if they'd come through a d'Hondt set-up? (Clumping seats together in reasonably natural "list" areas like Dublin Metro and South Leinster.)

    ReplyDelete
  44. @unknown 12:56am. You would be prepared to forego the trade with RUK to trade with the EU. Knickerless has now conceded there would be border controls. How would Scotland transport its good to the EU?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. By the same ways it does now.

      If goods were simply passing from an EU Scotland through a non-EU England and on to mainland EU, no customs charges / tariffs would apply as goods would be classed as 'In transit'. It's only when they arrive at the final destination do goods become liable for any such charges. Everyone with half a brain knows this.

      The Boris bridge is the other option of course. That would bypass England completely.

      Delete
  45. Oh Dear Skier you seemed to have rattled a few BritNat cages today. Ye see you are supposed to duck up to their imperial masters (like they do) not bloody call em out. They don't like it up em that's for sure. :)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I think anyone with any sense knows exactly what I mean by my posts, and why I keep saying it.

      I'm not going to stand silent in the face of such bullying.

      It was Johnson with his No Section 30 that made England a cowardly nation in the eyes of Scots and the world, humiliating decent, brave, democratic English folks.

      There is nothing strong nor brave in No section 30, only cowardice.

      Delete
    2. Skier, I thought you were being deported today tae sunny Jamaica.

      Delete
  46. A sense of balance:

    "The leader of Birmingham City Council has welcomed the HS2 announcement, describing it as a "once in a generation opportunity to rebalance the UK economy."

    ReplyDelete
  47. Skier, in the event that the UK does a trade deal with the USA will you Nat sis refuse to participate?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Can you make funny sounds with your teeth and cgeeoks? I can. I can play the William Tell overture by flicking my fingers against my cheeks and tightening them. This helps me when I do trade deals with Swiss people. Like they say, Nothing some money, nothing some Swiss.

      Delete
    2. I asked you a civil question. Answer please.

      Delete
  48. Scotland already trades with the US of A within International recognised standards
    You should remember GWC that America does not want English beef they want Scottish beef because of it's safety record but they want it cheaper

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. UK beef is all regulated. Over 60% of Scottish trade is with RUk, why wil Scottish Nat sis not acknowledge this. 20% of trade is with non EU countries.

      Delete
    2. It's better that Scotland diversifies away from the UK and starts trading with the wider world. The UK market is in decline.

      Delete
  49. BBC now openly discussing options for Irish Unity. With Sinn Fein heading for office in Dublin, the game's up. The red saltire is being unpicked from the union flag as the border forms down the Irish sea.

    Thanks Boris. You're making it all happen so much quicker than I could have ever hoped for.

    And thanks to that Cummings fella tae. I'm all up for him advising you on Holyrood 2021 strategy too; see if he can lose you half your MSPs like he did your Scots MPs.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-51456404

    Could EU's attitude to Irish unity mirror approach to German reunification?

    Mary Lou McDonald's confirmation to BBC Newsnight that she would ask Ireland's fellow EU member states to take a more active role in backing Irish unification won't surprise anyone who read Sinn Féin's election manifesto.

    The section of the document which deals with Irish unity talks about the need for a future Dublin government to "engage with our friends and neighbours in the EU".

    It specifically mentions the precedent set 30 years ago when "the EU financially and politically supported German reunification".

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The EU will not interfere in UK internal politics. The Germans paid a unification tax from their earnings. The German ruling classes have got richer since unification and the workers are still in austerity. The German ruling class still use the fear of the Nazis to keep the workers pacified.

      Delete
    2. It's not the EU you need to fear. It's England. It is the threat to the union you love.

      Delete
    3. My country has left the EU due to a democratic referendum so no fear and never was. If the Union ends then life goes on. You are the person who seems to have fear of the English. Sad man at a computer.

      Delete
    4. I'm not at all scared of cowards, no.

      Delete
    5. Your frog Mrs must be bored but not by you.

      Delete
  50. "My country has left the EU".

    "My country" ???????

    Must be England!

    Ha ha ha ha ha.

    Democracy in action? Aye right!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Scotland iz ma Country ya tally wop immigrant. You are probably related tae Berlusconi and Mussolini.

      Delete
    2. Oh Dear yer a wee bit confused.If Scotland is yer country it voted 62% remain. How exactly did ye square that circle? Ho Jo.

      Delete
    3. It was a UK election. Scotland doesn't get a say.

      Delete
  51. The trouble with Britnatz has always been geography and history and, well education in general really

    Oh they do present unflinching servility and obedience to their masters though, the little house Jocks that they are

    Quite embarrassing for us real Scots to see them bum licking their Royals and their English betters

    ReplyDelete
  52. "Ma country has left the EU due to a democratic blah blah!"

    "Scotland is ma country blah blah!"

    Oops Doh! Homer Simpson moment.

    ReplyDelete
  53. Hoisted by yer own petard. Ho ho.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Bag of chips, brown sauce and two pickled onions please.

      Delete
    2. Broon sauce is Edinburgh. In Glaesga it's vinegar.

      Delete
  54. Don't ye want a Cornetto?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Naw a bag a chips wie gravy an a can a diet Irn Bru please.

      Delete
    2. @ GWC And a roll up fur efters fur maryhills maist famous stoat the baw , GWC .

      Delete
  55. Scottish IRA SupporterFebruary 11, 2020 at 11:55 PM

    Sinn Fein Mary Loo aka Ms Whiplash to publish glorious IRA deeds in photographic colour of the dead and wounded done in their name. Be warned this is not a butchers shop window it is the remains of human beings.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. UDA Terrorist & former UK Government Coalition MemberFebruary 12, 2020 at 7:56 AM

      English are traitorous scum. Never trust them. They betrayed us British and now Ulster will be Irish in a few years.

      Delete
    2. Yes the English are what you say they are that's why they created you to subvert an entire country so they could own it
      and now you have the cheek to be annoyed about a people taking back what was rightfully theirs, is it just OK for England to *take back control*
      Forget about religion, your country and freedom come first, I kinda don't think even the perverted religion that you really don't follow says anywhere in that doctrine that a people should be prisoners in their own land in order to worship anything they choose, or don't choose

      Ireland was Ireland before the English got their dirty mitts into it, Christianity is only 2 thousand years old and the folk who divided it up into different rules to follow so they could benefit from the division is a lot less than that
      Ireland the land was there before all of that and will be there after you're gone, religions are just a new fad as far as the land is concerned

      Delete
    3. It was the Normans that invaded Ireland after beating the Anglo Saxons.

      Delete
    4. @ GWC Was it norman who invaded ireland all by his self wis it? Yer history is as shite as your comments on this page yan auld roaster.

      Aye the norman french did invade in the 12th century , but the irish later assimilated them and they became more irish than the irish. That was why englands rule by the 16th century was reduced down to the pale of dublin , and the english tudors had to try and reconquer all the land they had lost .

      Yer english hero fat henry the eighth set up his own mini kafflick religion so he could be the head of it , called it the church of engerlund , so he could get the leg over pam and her five sisters.

      When he invaded scotland GWC , you would have been standing at the border wae yer wee white feather welcoming him , tugging yer forelock and tugging yer foreskin at the thought of being english at last.

      Delete
    5. The Pope gave authority for the Normans to invade Ireland. The Scottish Bruce invaded a bit later. Henry V111 was a good guy who gave us Elizabeth 1 both the scourge of the ersebandit papes. OK Govan rent boy.

      Delete
    6. @GWC Just as the pope , Innocent the 11th , supported william of orange and gave him catholic troops and funds to put james 7th to flight in Ireland.

      Just as william of orange forced a quarter of a million presbyterians to flee his "religous freedom " , back in the day when protestants of the wrong sort were banned from holding any office or postiton in the military or law and presbyterian schoolmasters were liable for three months prison for teaching.

      Long before the days when henry cooke begged the high tory conservative elitist orange ludge to lift the ban on ordinary presbyterians to divide and conquer the catholic irish and protestant irish dissenter to british rule and allow dirty wee muck racking foreskin lickers like you into the ludge and make ye feel important.

      Whats a so called scotsman like you concerned wae english kings and queens for ya wee girls blouse ye!

      Delete
    7. I am told you troll around the Mary Barbour memorial at Govan X and you are cheap.

      Delete
    8. @ GWC yer maw wis cheap when a stranger gave her a stairheid ride and she fell pregnant wae you yan auld helmet licker.

      Delete
  56. S/S, Kelly and all.

    https://www.thejournal.ie/sinn-fein-left-surplus-5001343-Feb2020/
    One in the eye for J. Kelly

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. How? surely in a transferable vote election you need to transfer your vote? now if we could have that for the Scottish Parliament...

      Delete
  57. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-51458215

    Former Conservative and pro-union Aberdeen sex assault councillor 'will not step back from duties'

    The former deputy provost of Aberdeen who was found guilty of sexual assault has said he will not be stepping back from his duties.

    Former Conservative Alan Donnelly had denied kissing and touching a man who was working at an event in the city.

    Donnelly was ordered to pay £800 compensation last month and will be under supervision of the social work department for eight months.

    He is still considering his position but has now said he will not hide.

    The councillor has so far resisted calls to quit as an elected member.

    ReplyDelete
  58. Erm, well why isn't the article entitled 'Countess of Strathearn visits...' then?

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-51474866

    The Duchess of Cambridge has helped out at a cafe run by a homelessness charity in Aberdeen.

    The Duchess of Cambridge has helped out at a cafe run by a homelessness charity in Aberdeen.

    Catherine - known as the Countess of Strathearn when in Scotland - was at Social Bite.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Because that's what the PA titled it.
      https://pa.media/royal-family-collection/

      As for the why its pretty simple, Duchess of Cambridge, is a more searched term than 'Countess of Strathearn.'

      Delete
    2. It seems you missed my point entirely. Sure, scots sensibilities are not important to the ebc.

      But why undermine the union like this? Just a little chip, but one of so many.

      As an indy supporter, I think its fine, but why do the BBC undermine unionists in this way, ie by making them have to defend little slights?

      It makes no sense to me.

      Delete
    3. You must of missed the bit were I said the peice was written by the PA?

      You know how the Pa operates right , they write the piece (including headline) that then gets published by news organisations.

      Its nothing to do with Scots sensibilities, unless you are saying The National cares nothing for Scots sensibilities:

      https://www.thenational.scot/news/uk-news/18230244.duchess-cambridge-visit-homelessness-charity-cafe/

      Anyhow must be a quiet news day if this is the best that you can find in your daily trawl of 'UK bad' stories.

      Delete
    4. The national is pro-indy, so would naturally not encourage unionism by pushing her Scottish title. As broadly a republican, I'd be disturbed by the national going all 'Scottish' royal loving.

      By contrast, if I saw the BBC starting to call her the Duchess of Strathearn every time she was in Scotland, I'd be like 'WTF, clever bastards' as that's exactly the kind of thing that would promote the union, rather than the usual anglo centrism.

      There's lots of examples. Like these two:

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-22031264
      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-22015368

      Only down the bottom are their real, legal Scottish titles mentioned.

      And people are forced to pay for the BBC. If folk don't like the national, they can simply not buy it. The 'English' BBC threatens you with fines and even jail.

      Like I said. I think that's great though! It's got Scots disliking the BBC more than any other UK nation, which I'm really pleased by.

      Delete
    5. Oh, and do you know why the English NHS uses the twitter handle 'NHSuk'?

      It's not the UK NHS.

      https://twitter.com/NHSuk

      It just undermines the union by trying to claim England = UK.

      Delete
    6. Its been using that handle since 2007. Cant see it causing any outrage upto now. As I said slow news day, I get it you have nothing to look forward to (the Scot Gov is too chickenshit to call a ref that is in their powers) but really is royal titles and twitter handles the best you have.

      Delete
    7. It was enough to get you on the defensive, so as effective as hoped for.

      I see English Johnson is openly trousering bribes now. Nice. A real Scot nat asset.

      SNP cabinet yet might turn out to be chickenshit, but England as a whole is chickenshit. MPs could easily overrule Johnson on an S30, forcing it through, but they're not because they're mostly cowardly, pathetic, freeloading wasters it seems, representing every part of England.

      Delete
    8. The Duchess of Cambridge - known as "Who?" when in Scotland - was on another jaunt to get away from her children and draw attention from Prince Andrew, who wasn't asked to babysit.

      Delete
    9. Baroness Ethel GruntFebruary 13, 2020 at 8:17 AM

      She should join up with princesses Beatrice and Eugenie who were great when they used to appear in the Les Dawson Show as the Roly Polys.

      Delete
  59. Ah, now I see where the Kintyre - Coleraine Causeway fits in...

    "A Dutch government scientist has proposed building two mammoth dams to completely enclose the North Sea and protect an estimated 25 million Europeans from the consequences of rising sea levels as a result of global heating.
    Sjoerd Groeskamp, an oceanographer at the Royal Netherlands Institute for Sea Research, said a 475km dam between north Scotland and west Norway and another 160km one between west France and south-west England was “a possible solution”.
    In a paper to be published this month in the American Journal of Meteorology, Groeskamp and Joakim Kjellsson of the Geomar centre for ocean research in Kiel, Germany, say the idea is affordable and technically feasible – if intended more as “a warning of the immensity of the problem hanging over our heads”.
    The cost of building a so-called North Sea Enclosure Dyke, estimated at between €250bn and £500bn, amounts to barely 0.1% of the combined GDP of all the countries that would be protected by it, they calculate.
    Groeskamp said it also appeared technically viable. The depth of the North Sea between France and England rarely exceeded 100 metres, he said, while between Scotland and Norway it averaged about 127 metres, peaking at just over 320 off the coast of Norway."

    (fae The Girniad)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. This project seems to be about saving humans. Is it worth it when we have Skier and Govan young team.

      Delete
    2. I think we should make the Dutchies sweat and extract maximum reparations for AbellioRail.
      Or you could volunteer to be buried in the foundations as a tribute to their one-time king.

      Delete
    3. @ GWC Av jist boat 8 legs ae venison fur forty quid. Dae ye hink That’s two deer?

      Delete
    4. That's an auld wan wis it Chic Murray?

      Delete
  60. As I said, a freeloader.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-51482220

    Businessman pays £15,000 towards Boris Johnson's holiday

    The cost of Boris Johnson's accommodation for his New Year's holiday was covered by the co-founder of Carphone Warehouse, David Ross.

    Mr Ross is named in the MPs' register of interests as donating £15,000 towards the PM's private Caribbean break with his partner, Carrie Symonds.

    Mr Ross was one of Mr Johnson's aides in City Hall and was appointed to the Olympics organising committee.


    Do you really think brexit will be a success with this cowardly shyster in charge?

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. 'Take back control from the elites who are ripping us off' lol.

      Delete
    2. Again is that it. Shock horror leader of a country gets stuff paid for him. Anyhow 15k is nothing its 12 hours work at Ian Blackford's going rate.

      As I said must be a slow 'UK is bad' day.

      Delete
    3. I'm sure most Scots voters will be happy at Johnson using his position to trouser £15k in a brown envelope.

      After all, rich businessmen give such some to politicians all the time and expect nothing in return!

      51% has maybe edged up by 0.2, 0.3%...

      Delete
  61. Johnson is a gigantic union wrecking ball. £15k towards the holiday for favours to big business. Sweet. That's many people's wage for f'n year. A deposit struggling young folks can't put together for a house. And English 'I'll take your vote off you jock scum' Boris just pockets it with a sly smile.

    I love the guy. He's the best thing that's happened to the indy cause in years.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Bus contracts to the Scottish stonhenge company must ammount to a lot. Especially to stop nationalisation. Tory Busman has Nat sis in his pocket.

      Delete
  62. I see Stephen Gerrard lost another game of football and has become a Fenian Bastirt, it didn't take them long did it

    Now he understands why folk warned him

    ReplyDelete
  63. Latest on Johnson's reshuffle.
    Tank commander to become parachutist.
    Seems disrespect for Scotland has reached new levels.
    Baroness Davidson has nae shame, but we knew that.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Scots Tory voters hate freeloaders.

      After SNP voters, they are by far the most opposed to their taxes being spent on England's HS2 (Yougov Scotland).

      Delete
  64. Skier, just reading that the May Day Holiday 2020 has changed to Friday 8 May 2020. This is to commemorate VE Day 75 years on since the Nazi surrender. Lots of parades and ceremonies to be held across the UK including Edinburgh and Glasgow. This will surely upset your Nat si flagwavers. You would not want to offend your new Nazi German sponsors.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. The Nazis refused section 30's for all countries the third Reich took control of.

      Delete
  65. Oh look it was a pattern of behaviour, shocker.

    https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/news/5266960/derek-mackay-shaun-cameron-police/

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. This comment has been removed by the author.

      Delete
    2. Erm, that's an old article talking about even older news.

      Mackay's gone and the world has moved on.

      If Mackay was still in cabinet and the SNP were running around trying to protect him, then the scandal would go on and could start to damage them. But they dumped him immediately, so Jock public no longer cares unless they're a bit of a weirdo pervert like yourself who's fixated by other people's (possible, maybe in this case, but not proven) gay fantasies.

      This is in the news now:

      https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-51458215

      Former Conservative & Pro-union Aberdeen sex assault Councillor 'will not step back from duties'

      Which is just a wee bitty more serious (unless Mackay is actually charged with something).

      And of course 'Brown envelope Boris' is the main headline story.

      Mackaygate won't have won unionists a single % point in polls (we can be absolutely confident of), just like e.g. Bill Walker didn't.

      People vote for delivery of positives. Negatives are rather useless, and can even harm you if that's all you offer.

      In mackaygate, the public can clearly see unionists don't give a shit for the young man concerned or children of real abuse. Instead, they are showing contempt by using the issue simply in an attempt to attack Scots and allow the English to continue to subvert democracy so Johnson can line his freeloading pockets.

      Delete
    3. To be clear, despite all your bluster, I very much doubt you'd call me a 'weirdo pervert' to my face. You'd be walking away from the interaction with a broken nose if so.

      Delete
    4. I'm not taking sides in the dispute between you and Scottish Skier, but I think I'm right in saying that you identify as a radical feminist? I remember having discussions with you years back about "game" and so on. What do you think it is about men who self-identify as feminists making threats of physical violence? I've noticed this again and again. It's a really odd phenomenon.

      Delete
    5. You are incorrect, I do not identify as a radical feminist.

      I am probably a somewhat more sympathetic to the trans side of the current debate on bathrooms, though I do recognise there is room for legitimate concern about self-ID.

      There is a whole broad spectrum of feminisms. Radical feminism is rather too essentialist for my liking, and I see separatism as a dead end. As a man, it'd be hard for me to do otherwise. I do not remember any conversation with you about 'game', but, assuming I know what you mean by that term, I think it's more than possible to criticise the PUA (pick-up artist) universe and its attitude towards women without being a radical feminist.

      I think it's a pity you have chosen to pick me up on this, but not a word to Scottish Skier about libelling me on your blog with use of the term 'weirdo pervert'.

      Delete
    6. I'm sorry you think it's a pity I picked you up on your threat of violence. I'm even more sorry that you haven't reflected upon your error of judgement and apologised for it, or at least stepped back from it. As I said, your slanging match with Scottish Skier is a matter between you and him, and I'm not remotely interested in policing playground insults. But a threat of violence is very different territory, and is distinctly odd coming from a male feminist (I gather it's only the word 'radical' you're quibbling about).

      Delete
  66. Latest on this headline story.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-51487701

    Conservative and Pro-union Sexual assault councillor case 'must not become a witch hunt'

    ReplyDelete
  67. Total bloodbath at No. 10.

    Johnson has sacked the 'best N. Ireland Secretary in decades', with the province now up in arms over it, both nationalist and unionist alike.

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-politics-smith/johnson-sacks-minister-who-restored-northern-ireland-power-sharing-idUKKBN20713T

    England has given up on NI and the union now it seems following the SF win.

    Javid has quit too. He was barely competent and that's all the Tories had for the post.

    UK's fucked. Johnson's lost it.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Ha Ha Ha Ha. No wonder Ruthie seems to be heading for the HoL. They will need her soon enough. Not that she is any good, but BJ is running out of options Ho Ho.

      Wait for it:


      Ruthie for Chancellor of the Exchequer!


      Now that WOULD be a larf. Ye never know. :)

      Delete
  68. Questions from a Yougov poll received today about the SNP include:

    In the past few weeks,several negative stories have emerged about senior SNP politicians, including about the conduct of Alex Salmond and Derek Mackay. Have these stories changed your opinion about the SNP at all?

    Yes, it makes me less likely to support them
    No, it hasn’t affected my view of the party as a whole
    I haven’t seen these stories.

    When considering which party to vote for, which of these is most important?

    Their policies on things like healthcare, the economy, and education

    How trustworthy and capable their leader is

    Their vision for Scotland

    That they are competent and responsible

    Their position on independence

    None of these

    What are the most important issues that would influence how you would vote if the Holyrood election was held tomorrow? (Please tick up to three)

    Cracking down on large multi-national companies

    Taxation

    Housing

    The Environment and Climate Change

    The NHS

    Managing immigration

    Devolution and constitutional reform

    Jobs and employment

    The cost of living

    Keeping Scotland in the Union

    Ensuring that we maintain close links to the EU, with a pathway to rejoining

    Public finances and the deficit/debt

    Terrorism, defence and national security

    Obtaining Independence from the UK

    Transportation

    Crime and Anti-Social Behaviour

    The economy

    Maintaining and increasing Pensions and Benefits provision

    Education: Schools & Universities

    Poverty & Inequality

    Healing division and restoring faith in political institutions

    Ensuring that Scotland leaves the EU

    Public ownership of energy, water and the railways

    Social care for the elderly and disabled

    None of these

    Don't know

    Generally speaking, do you think Scotland is heading in the right or wrong direction?

    Right direction

    Wrong direction

    Don’t know

    Here are several pairs of statements. In each case please indicate where, on a 10-point scale, best represents the type of Scotland you want to live in. 0 means you completely agree with the first statement and 10 means you completely agree with the second.
    FIRST STATEMENT: For Scotland to work together with other countries on shared objectives

    FIRST STATEMENT: For anyone in the UK to access essential services, such as hospitals and schools, anywhere in the UK, including Scotland
    SECOND STATEMENT: For only Scots to be allowed to access essential services, such as hospitals and schools, in Scotland
    FIRST STATEMENT: Where people are free to act as they wish
    SECOND STATEMENT: Where there is order in society
    FIRST STATEMENT: For the Union
    SECOND STATEMENT: Against the Union
    FIRST STATEMENT: Government benefits readily accessible to people who are struggling to get by
    SECOND STATEMENT: Government benefits less readily available to people who have never contributed anything in return
    FIRST STATEMENT: No legalisation of cannabis as it is a gateway drug to more serious narcotics
    SECOND STATEMENT: Legalisation and taxation of cannabis
    FIRST STATEMENT: Less government spending on the NHS and a re-think of more sustainable ways of funding a Scottish-only healthcare system
    SECOND STATEMENT: Increased funding for the NHS even if it means higher taxes

    SECOND STATEMENT: For Scotland to protect its own interests
    FIRST STATEMENT: Less regulation to help businesses and assist growth
    SECOND STATEMENT: Greater regulation to protect workers, consumers and the public
    FIRST STATEMENT: Fiscal responsibility
    SECOND STATEMENT: Increased government spending and borrowing
    FIRST STATEMENT: A justice system that is more about rehabilitation than punishment
    SECOND STATEMENT: Harsher sentencing and longer jail time for criminals
    FIRST STATEMENT: Decreased funding on foreign aid
    SECOND STATEMENT: Continued spend of 0.7% of gross national income on overseas development
    FIRST STATEMENT: Individual rights are protected
    SECOND STATEMENT: To look out for the common good





    ReplyDelete
  69. Yougov cont'd.

    FIRST STATEMENT: Less expenditure on the military as it won’t lead to lasting peace
    SECOND STATEMENT: Increased military spending in these uncertain times
    FIRST STATEMENT: Zero hour contracts offer useful work to those who need flexible working hours
    SECOND STATEMENT: Abolishment of zero hours contracts
    FIRST STATEMENT: Less immigration
    SECOND STATEMENT: Greater immigration
    FIRST STATEMENT: The Scottish government should prioritise governing for Scottish people born in Scotland
    SECOND STATEMENT: The Scottish government should be encouraged to create a society that is open to all - particularly those from outside the U.K
    FIRST STATEMENT: Increased taxation, bigger government and more spending in public services
    SECOND STATEMENT: Lower taxes, smaller government and less spending on public services

    FIRST STATEMENT: Less expenditure on the military as it won’t lead to lasting peace
    SECOND STATEMENT: Increased military spending in these uncertain times
    FIRST STATEMENT: Zero hour contracts offer useful work to those who need flexible working hours
    SECOND STATEMENT: Abolishment of zero hours contracts
    FIRST STATEMENT: Less immigration
    SECOND STATEMENT: Greater immigration
    FIRST STATEMENT: The Scottish government should prioritise governing for Scottish people born in Scotland
    SECOND STATEMENT: The Scottish government should be encouraged to create a society that is open to all - particularly those from outside the U.K
    FIRST STATEMENT: Increased taxation, bigger government and more spending in public services
    SECOND STATEMENT: Lower taxes, smaller government and less spending on public services

    What makes you proud to be Scottish and/or British? (Please tick all that apply)

    Renewables sector

    Our expanded welfare state (eg. free prescriptions)

    Our sense of humour

    Business

    Our Food and Drink (eg. Whisky, Haggis, agricultural products)

    Our NHS

    Our potential in the world

    Our political system

    Our standing on the world stage

    Our history

    Our culture, film and music

    Our sports teams

    Our Monarchy

    Our open society / tolerance

    Our multi-culturalism and diversity

    Our universities and education system

    Our armed forces

    None of these

    ReplyDelete
  70. YouGov cont'd

    Do you see the following institutions as more British or Scottish?
    More British Equally Scottish and British More Scottish Don’t know
    Our multi-culturalism and diversity
    Our Monarchy
    Our culture, film and music
    Our open society / tolerance
    Our history
    Our universities and education system
    Our political system
    Our NHS
    Our sense of humour
    Business
    Our expanded welfare state (eg. free prescriptions)
    Our Food and Drink (eg. Whisky, Haggis, agricultural products)
    Our potential in the world
    Renewables sector
    Our armed forces
    Our standing on the world stage
    Our sports teams

    On a scale of 0 to 10, where 0 means you feel negatively towards the region/nation and 10 means you feel positively towards the region/nation, how do you feel towards each of the following regions/nations?
    0 - Feel negatively towards the region/ nation 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 - Feel positively towards the region/nation
    England
    Scotland
    Wales
    Northern Ireland
    South of England
    The North of England
    London
    The Union
    The Republic of Ireland
    Great Britain
    The United Kingdom

    In which ways do you interact with England, English people, and English institutions? (Please tick all that apply)

    I am English

    I have family in England, and I speak to them or am in contact with them

    Some of my friends are English

    I sometimes travel to London for work

    I connect with some English people via social media

    I went to university in England

    I watch English TV programs

    I have lived in London at some point

    I sometimes travel to England (but not London) for work

    I sometimes go on holiday to England

    I have lived in England (but not London) at some point

    I grew up in England

    I went to university with English people

    I watch English football

    I don't interact with England, English people, English institutions

    Don't know

    Regarding Scotland’s place within the United Kingdom, which phrases best capture your opinion? (Please tick all that apply)

    ReplyDelete
  71. Irrespective of what you think about independence, the SNP are the wrong people to bring it about

    I think there are some benefits to the Union, but on balance, today, given the last 10 years, I think the benefits of independence are stronger

    I think on balance Scotland should be within the Union, but I understand why some people support Independence

    Scotland once had a place within the Union, but I don’t think it makes sense to be part of the UK any more

    I strongly think Scotland should definitely be within the Union

    Scotland should never have joined the Union, and has been damaged by its relationship with the UK over the last 300 years

    I think Scotland needs to find a new place either within the Union, or just outside, but I don’t know exactly how

    I am don’t have strong opinions about the Union, and Scotland’s place in it

    I have changed my mind repeatedly on this issue, and still don’t know how I will vote

    None of these capture my opinion

    On a scale of 0 to 10, how likely is it that you would vote in a referendum on Scottish independence?

    0 - Certain not to vote


    10 - Absolutely certain to vote

    If another Scottish Independence Referendum were held today, how would you vote?

    No to an independent Scotland

    Yes to an independent Scotland

    I will not vote

    I am not registered to vote

    On a scale of 0-10, where 0 means ‘I completely support Scotland and the UK remaining part of the EU’ and 10 means ‘I completely support Scotland and the UK leaving the EU’, what number would you choose yourself to be?

    0 - I completely support Scotland and the UK remaining part of the EU

    Which of the following hypothetical scenarios do you think would be a price worth paying, if it meant that Scotland achieved independence from the UK? (Please tick all that apply)

    Lack of access to British public services for specialist healthcare

    Hard border with England in the Scottish Borders

    Total breakdown in relations with England and parts of Northern Ireland

    Immigration controls between England and Scotland

    Scotland as a whole gets substantially poorer

    I myself personally lose my income and get substantially poorer

    Moving goods and people between Scotland and the rest of the UK becomes difficult

    The party I support breaks apart

    Sectarian disruption

    A Scottish Government has to carry out decades of austerity to balance the books

    Shetland and Orkney, and the Borders becoming more separatist against Scotland

    The party I support loses the next general election

    None of these would be a price worth paying

    Don't know

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. That reads like a poll for a university, or something like that. I'd dispute the premise of one or two of the questions - there have been negative stories about Alex Salmond, certainly, but in the last few weeks? All I can think of is a routine court hearing.

      Delete
  72. How you would feel if...
    Delighted Angry Satisfied Surprised Indifferent Scared Relieved Confused Disappointed None of these
    Scotland became Independent?
    Scotland became a federal state within a new federal British state?
    The status quo was maintained?
    Scotland received more law making powers from Westminster?
    Scotland voted again to remain part of the United Kingdom?
    Scotland had a new Independence Referendum?
    The Scottish Parliament was abolished?

    What statement do you agree with the most?

    Scotland is a united country

    Scotland is broadly united

    Scotland has some divisions

    Scotland is deeply divided

    Who is responsible for these divisions? (Please tick all that apply)

    All politicians

    Alex Salmond

    Ordinary English people

    Unionists

    The 2016 European Referendum

    Westminster politicians

    Labour

    Boris Johnson

    Everyone bears some responsibility

    Scottish politicians

    The European Union

    Conservatives

    The 2014 Scottish Referendum

    Nationalists

    SNP

    The prospect of a second Independence Referendum

    Nicola Sturgeon

    Social Media

    None of these

    Don't know

    ReplyDelete
  73. Which of the following comes closest to your view?

    We've always had political disagreements in Scotland, division is nothing new
    On a scale of 0 to 10, where 0 means you do not identify with that group at all, and 10 means you fully identify with that group, for each of the following, how do you identify?
    0 - Do not identify with this group 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 - Fully identify with this group
    Scottish
    Highlander
    Catholic
    Protestant
    Ulster-Scots
    British
    Central Belt
    English
    Islander
    Northern Irish
    Lowlander
    Irish
    Borderlands / Borders
    Glaswegian
    European

    We are divided now, but it will blow over in time

    The divisions in Scotland on independence and Brexit will last for a generation, and may never be healed

    None of these

    Should the Scottish Parliament be able to unilaterally call a referendum on independence?

    Yes – as long as there is a majority in the Scottish Parliament for a referendum it should be allowed

    No – it’s right that a referendum has to be called in conjunction with the UK Parliament
    Next page

    The was a page on when the next Independence ref should happen -

    next question -

    If the 2021 Holyrood Scottish Elections turn into a Referendum on whether Scotland should have a Second Independence vote, how will you vote?

    SNP

    Either SNP or Scottish Green, whichever helps get a pro Independence majority

    Scottish Labour

    Scottish Conservatives

    Scottish Liberal Democrats

    Either Scottish Labour or Scottish Tories , whichever stops a Second Referendum

    Either Scottish Labour or Scottish Liberals, whichever stops a Second Referendum

    Either Scottish Conservatives or Scottish Liberals, whichever stops a Second Referendum

    I won’t be voting on the issue of Independence

    ReplyDelete
  74. I thought it would only be a couple of question - but it was very long. Look like an anti-independence organisation poll.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Maybe powerhouse MP (sorry, ex-MP) Pamela Nash got some pocket money from her bosses in London and chose to spend it on a fun quiz for her and colleagues in the Tory Party to mull over in deep contemplation while understanding not a word.

      Delete