Wednesday, November 13, 2019

SNP take on the broadcasters in court over the rigged leaders' debates

So I was encouraged to receive an email from the SNP a few minutes ago revealing that they've decided to take the plunge and challenge the broadcasters in court over the rigged leaders' debates.  I must admit there was a little while when I was worried that they might let this pass without even putting up a fight, but I should never have doubted them.  There's also a fundraiser to cover the cost of the action, which you can find HERE.  (It appears to be for SNP members only.)

Of course the dilemma with this sort of thing is always that if the court case is lost, you're left in exactly the same place that you started, apart from the fact that you've got less money than before.  But that's the nature of the beast - you can't win a raffle if you don't buy a ticket, and the potential benefits if the case is won (or perhaps I should say the potential avoidance of harm) is so great that it seems to me it's well worth the risk.  It's also important to lay down a marker and emphasise that people haven't just been going through the motions by objecting to these rigged debates - the proposed format really is outrageous.  There's been an attempt to gaslight us by portraying two-way leaders' debates as "traditional", but in fact they've never taken place in UK general elections before.  Not even once.  There were no leaders' debates at all prior to 2010.  There were three-way debates in 2010, and multi-party debates (including the SNP) in both 2015 and 2017.

What are the chances of success in court?  Heaven only knows, but it should be remembered that it's not unheard of for judges to rule against the broadcasters in cases of this type.  In 1995, Labour and the Liberal Democrats successfully persuaded a Scottish court to block the broadcast of a Panorama special featuring an extended interview with the then Tory Prime Minister John Major in the middle of a Scottish local election campaign.  The killer question posed by the judge was whether such a programme would ever have been scheduled during an English local election campaign, and the BBC were unable to answer.  They were allowed to go ahead with the broadcast in the rest of the UK, but not in parts of Northern Ireland and northern England where there was a danger of transmission carrying into Scotland.  Then a few years later, a court gave retrospective relief after ITV broadcast an "Ask the Prime Minister" special featuring Tony Blair in the middle of a Scottish parliamentary by-election campaign.  STV were ordered to broadcast a similar programme giving time to the other party leaders.

On the other hand, the SNP's challenge to the 2010 general election debates featuring only Brown, Cameron and Clegg did fail entirely.  But two things have changed since then - a) the SNP are now the third largest party in the UK Parliament, and b) there is a clear precedent for the SNP being included in UK debates on an equal basis.  If it was appropriate for the SNP to be included in 2015, when they were going into the election with just six seats, it's very hard to understand why it's appropriate to exclude them now, when they're going into an election with thirty-five seats.

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I have constituency previews for Edinburgh West and Edinburgh South-West in The National today - you can read them HERE and HERE.  And you can also take a sneak peek at my monthly column in iScot magazine HERE.

36 comments:

  1. Good. This is what needs to be challenge.

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  2. Thank heavens they have gone for it. Great news.

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  3. I'm glad they r fighting this it is a joke the way this has been handled from the start. Just a question though James because my memory could be playing tricks on me. Was there a Cameron/Milliband head to head one year?

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    1. No, there wasn't. The only proper debate Cameron turned up for in 2015 was the seven-way ITV debate. Bizarrely, the BBC also ran a five-way "challengers' debate" that included Miliband and Sturgeon, but not Cameron or Clegg on the spurious grounds that they were in government. (Cameron refused to turn up so the BBC needed a cover story for going ahead without him.)

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    2. Oh yes, didn't Clegg try a challenge to get into that one?

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    3. I remember the Lib Dems complaining about it (and understandably so) but as far as I can remember they didn't attempt a legal challenge. I may be wrong, but I don't think they did.

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  4. If the Nat sis want to be UK inclusive then they should accept the result of the EU referendum. All they will go on about in any debate is independence, hard done tae stories and how they want the EU to run Scotland.

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  5. So the Scottish Greens are to be cut out of the
    Scottish TV debate.So that will be the usual three to one fiasco of the Labour,Liberal and conservative unionist audience against Nicola Sturgeon.

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    1. All Knickerless will say is the Tories are to blame for Nat si failings which they will still say if Scotland were independent.

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    2. Yes, and even after Brexit, you lot will continue to blame the EU for the UK being a pile of shit.

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  6. What are they seeking? Inclusion in debate, or blocking it?

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    1. Inclusion. They're going to court in London, and I would guess that if blocking the broadcast had been their aim, or even if it had been their fall-back position, they would have chosen the Edinburgh route and tried to get it blocked in Scotland only.

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  7. The SNP aren't going to court for themselves, they're doing it for all party inclusion and for the voters to hear all parties and not just who the broadcasters want to present their *Britains got politicians* show when what they mean is *England's got politicians*

    England and it's politicians and broadcasters are anti Scottish anti Welsh anti Irish and anti everybody else that isn't them, not to mention anti democratic

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    1. The British voted to leave the EU and the forces of reaction who benefit from the EU went to the courts. Seems the judiciary have been running the country along with Bercow on behalf of the losers. And here was me thinking the majority is the winner.

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  8. Wings over Scotland royally screwing the donators to the Stuart Campbell fill my personal bank account site and they still can't see it. Don't they know that Mugabe was a good guy at one time and then turned coat with money talking? Chris Cairn's (hope he's getting paid more than peanuts) cartoon has been running for 5 days now and a new cartoon is due in 2 days time. All of this is going on at the most critical juncture in Scotland's history and Campbell the conman has nothing to offer other than tweeting away about trans and pizzas. No mention of the SNP fundraiser. Well why would he? Less money for him, as he hoovers up every penny from a bunch of mostly poor dupes to the detriment of every other genuine pro-independence site. Waken up folks. The worm has turned.

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    1. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    2. You obviously follow the wings site closely to bring us such regular, detailed updates.

      Which is genuinely weird thing to do if you hate his output.

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    3. Hello Skier - I do not understand why you continue to defend WOS or if not defend go after people who criticise it. I put money into his fundraiser and I didn't for it for the things he is spouting now - I did it for the things he said he was going to do with it when pitching for it. I do not support calling Nicola a liar, I do not support the idea of a new party either and although I partially agree with him on trans issues I do not agree with the way he goes about it. I go to many websites I do not agree with. My father - a communist - always said do not read the things you agree with, read your enemy - that's how you know what they are saying. Going back to WOS. I do think that the output has been drying up for some time. Perhaps he has nothing to say any more that is constructive, just vitriolic drivel or (as seems to be the case) just plain nothing. Try to remind yourself of what the fundraiser was for - all the elements - but so far we just have either silence or vitriol. The anonymous writer above was just pointing this out - I don't think he needed the attack.

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  9. .... too bloody right, James ... the SNP must make a stand on this issue .. as you state, there is a point of principal here ... if no challenge is put forward, then no objection was made ... by default the Unionist media have proved their point !!! ... we, of an Independence mind, must support this legal action.

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  10. English EVEL government must have come in their pants when they signed this off, sweaty little racists that they are.

    https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-immigration/eu-citizens-warned-over-missing-brexit-residency-deadline-idUKKBN1XO0RH

    Britain is threatening to deport European Union citizens if they fail to apply on time for a new immigration status after Brexit and will only grant leniency in exceptional circumstances, according to people briefed on the plans.

    Comes on the back of the plan to charge prospective nurses (including care home staff) etc hundreds of pounds for a visa application that could be refused.

    'Come to the UK. It costs hundreds just to find out if we will let you in or not. If we do let you in, we'll maybe deport you at short notice on one of the mass transportation trains we're putting on for all the other undesirables that have been here too long.'

    Plans for the mass deportation of foreigners....removing the vote from non-English minority groups who object...

    The UK is very, very close to slipping into full fascism.

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    1. yea disgusting when a country cracks down on non Nationals, throwing them out if they have not got the right paperwork (even if they have lived there for years) and limiting the number of immigrants it lets into the country, setting up a points based system, as you say close to fascism
      https://www.ft.com/content/ae546d22-ffe6-11e9-be59-e49b2a136b8d

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    2. I can't see the article.

      France has full free movement and is not threatening millions of citizens who have been legally there for decades with mass deportation. It is also not say millions of minority group citizens will have the right to vote removed from them.

      I can get a French passport easily, even though I've never lived in France. Simply being married to a French lady for a few years entitles me to that. The same cannot be said of the UK, where my wife is being threatened with deportation by English racists while they say they will remove my right to vote (and so be able to stop them) / overrule the result of future Scottish elections.

      Here is another country with a tough immigration policy:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_policy_of_North_Korea

      'We'll they are doing it too!' isn't an excuse. Only someone who is thick as pigshit thinks it is.

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    3. Why do you not just take your frog Mrs back to frog land and settle down in that wonderful former Colonial country.

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    4. Behave yourself Curtis.

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  11. The refusal of a section 30 means every Westminster policy is being forced on Scotland.

    All consent - the fundamental principle of rule by democracy - is removed if Scots cannot freely choose to end UK rule at a time that suits them (just as the UK freely chose brexit from the EU).

    So, e.g. deportation of people from Scotland is no longer something being undertaken by 'British' border forces, but occupying 'English' Nazi jackboots. The UBKA is only 'British' if Scots can freely consent to their operation in Scotland through an indyref at the time of their choosing.

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  12. The situation is that my wife will have seek permission from racists in England to remain in her own Scottish home of 20 years under threat of deportation. They may refuse this request, as they have done to many long term EU residents so far.

    At the same time, I have the PM of the UK and leader of the main opposition telling me that if I try to object to this at the ballot box, they will simply overrule the election result if my party wins, declaring the core policies of the latter / my vote illegal.

    This is fascism. It might be dressed up in polite BBC jolly good queens English, but there is no question about what it is.

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    1. Non-fascism is the UK government saying 'If you don't want to implement our policies Scotland, here is a permanent Section 30 and you can vote for indy without any intervention from us any time you like'.

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    2. Well, you and I would have thought that that would be a perfect democracy.

      Unfortunately that is not how it runs. I would think, I do think, that reducing the number of Tory seats in Scotland to risible numbers may concentrate Tory minds towards preferring their true constituency, which is South of the border, to us. Unfortunately that seems years off.

      So, we must make it as ugly as possible for BoJo and his chums to rule us. Every step he takes, every move he makes must be challenged legally and democratically.

      Do you or anyone else on here have a calendar of future Scottish Polls? I keep coming back here, probably twice a day to check on this, and for the last few days there has been nothing to see.

      Best wishes.

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    3. Agreed. This is the lunacy that is descending upon us. I agree with you that this is fascism, but fascism is being re-branded as freedom. It is an utterly repugnant game they are playing and it ought to be seen for what it is. Lies tarted up as true.

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    4. Fascism is normally the condition where elitists do not accept the result at the ballot box. The Scottish nat sis seem to be well up there the EU and Scottish referendums being two examples.

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  13. But a reply to Scottish Skier as of:

    Scottish SkierNovember 14, 2019 at 10:29 AM

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  14. Strange that Donald Tusk who has been helping build the EU Empire states that the UK leaving the EU could end the British Empire. Where has he been since the nineteen fifties.

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  15. Vote SNP on Dec.12th. End the evil of British nationalism dragging down and polluting Scotland.

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    1. Most Scots will be boozing it up on the 12th December celebrating early Xmas and New Year due to the excellent British Tory economic policies. Some will not make it to the polling stations and some will go to soccer matches.

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    2. Recommended for you:

      https://www.marisco.co.nz/shop/TheNed/x_cat/00313.html

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