Monday, August 3, 2015

What could be more nonsensical than the most sensible part of a ludicrous statement?

Kezia Dugdale in the Guardian -

"I want an elected second chamber for the UK and I believe it has to be based beyond London.

I’ll campaign for it to be based in Glasgow – where better than the biggest city of a nation that has just reaffirmed its commitment to keeping our country together? A yes city."

Is anyone else's head hurting?  It's obviously possible to pretend to misunderstand a statement from a Labour politician to make a mischievous point, but I genuinely had to read that several times before I had the faintest idea what she was talking about.  The first problem is that she uses the words 'nation' and 'country' in the same sentence and somehow expects us to know she means completely different things.  The only clue is the affectionate use of 'our', which is evidently meant to indicate that 'country' is a superior term, referring to Britain.  The inferior Scotland, which clearly 'we' have less emotional investment in, is merely 'a' nation.

Second problem : Glasgow is seemingly the most appropriate host for the UK's second chamber for two reasons - a) it's the largest city in 'a nation' that voted No in the referendum, and b) it's a city that voted Yes in the referendum.  Isn't that a total contradiction?  Or is it the contradiction itself that's supposed to make Glasgow so uniquely suitable?  Heaven only knows.

To get to Kezia's actual point rather than the extraordinary way she tries to explain it, this is the sort of thing that drives me mad about provincial-minded politicians.  Oh yes, she can "campaign" to her heart's content for something she has no power to deliver, and which is completely infeasible anyway.  Then her masters in London will pat her on the head, say no, and add "but isn't it wonderful to have someone so ambitious for Scotland?"

What does this fatuous charade mean or achieve?  If Kezia was making a serious point, she would campaign for the whole seat of parliament to be moved outside London - and probably not to Glasgow, but to somewhere central like Manchester or Newcastle.  At a stroke, that would transform the UK into a healthier nation state, where tens of millions of people are no longer suffering from the illusion that the far south-east corner where they live is basically the whole country.

Is there the slightest chance she will ever make that case?  Of course not.  That really would be getting above her station, and challenging the 'natural state of things'.  Instead, she makes the self-evidently daft proposal that the two chambers of parliament should be several hundred miles apart.  Can you think of any other country with such a ludicrous arrangement? 

Perhaps Kezia should take the advice Labour is forever doling out to the SNP - ie. forget the posturing, and concentrate on the powers she will actually have as Scottish branch office manager.

64 comments:

  1. What are 'Scottish' Labour doing? The mind boggles. It's impossible to parody this train wreck.

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  2. I did not think that was the most interesting part of her (to put it mildly) bizarre comments. What struck me was when she said, “But I want there to be a Labour government; otherwise I’m wasting my time."

    So she just admitted that the only reason she is in politics or in Labour is to be in power and if she doesn't get that she should just go off in a huff because she is 'wasting her time'. Now many knew that was the sole reason a lot of people ran for office with Labour, the previously perceived GUARANTEE of winning power in Scotland, but few come right out admit it--with considerable indignation at being denied their supposed due.

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    1. I think that's a misinterpretation. All she's doing is rehearsing the most prolific anti-Corbyn argument: that there's no point in a political party existing if it never gets the chance to implement its ideas.

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    2. On that interpretation, the point of SLab is becoming increasingly obscured.

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  3. "... tens of millions of people are no longer suffering from the illusion that the far south-east corner where they live is basically the whole country"

    Good to see you recognising the UK as a country James. But, more seriously, have you any evidence to show that all of us who live in SE England do not realise it is not the whole country. There are a large number of us who do not come from London, but have made it our home; while there are many more who were born down here, but who can see beyond their local vicinity. You might want to reword what you were trying to say to make it clearer. At the moment it comes across as ever so slightly blinkered.

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    1. As ever, I'm profoundly touched by your concern, "Jeff". But you'll be relieved to hear I've reviewed the blogpost, and am content with the original wording.

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    2. Fair enough, James, you are just a little prejudiced against the folk that live in the SE of England. You should get down here a little bit and try to meet a few of them. You might discover they are not all Del Boys and Tory toffs.

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    3. In defence of James, his comment makes sense if you read 'country' to mean England as well as Britain or the UK.

      More seriously, there are good reasons for avoiding 'country'. If you think that nations are different from states, as in 'The UK is a multinational state', it's dangerously easy to slip between country = state and country = nation. It's all too easy to find real-life examples of this.

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    4. I sometimes wonder if even you know what you're rambling about, "Jeff". Del Boys? What?

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    5. The UK is not a country or a nation, it is a nation state. I know British nationalists are very slow to recognise the difference.

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    6. @ muttley79: I have to disagree with you here. The UK is a state but not a nation-state. England, Scotland and Wales are nations (and Northern Ireland an anomaly) but there is no British or UK nation. The UK is maybe best understood as relict empire (think of the Falklands, Channel islands, etc.). Following on from this, what you call British nationalism is better seen as a kind of late imperialism.

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    7. Dennis, I would say that the UK/Britain is a nation state, given the Westminster Parliament, the House of Lords, Whitehall, the intelligence agencies, GCHQ, the Royal family, and the City, are all based in London. This is basically the major components of the British state. I agree that there is no UK or British nation as such, it is made up of England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland, and other territories around the world. It is really a multi-nation state.

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    8. The "United Kingdom" and "Britain" are euphemisms for a hegemonistic England or England's inner empire. Surely the second reading of the Scotland Bill made it crystal that Scots are vassals in a vassal state that comprises the hinterland of Greater England?

      We have de facto, a colonial governor and an ennobled deputy governor for goodness sake, appointed by a government that holds no mandate from the governed.

      Let's stop enabling this sleight of hand. The UK is as much one nation as the old Soviet Union was one nation. The fact that ethnic Estonians or Georgians had "CCCP" stamped on their official identity papers did not change the reality.

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  4. Och the poor lass was under pressure. She had one of those typical red tory brain-farts. It's the only possible explanation.

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  5. She is probably a very nice person, but it shows the dearth of talent in the Scottish branch of the British Labour Party if she is the favourite to be branch leader.
    Can anyone seriously imagine her as First Minister?

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    1. Juteman, I thought DC as PM was a bad enough nightmare. Remote as the possibility is, KD as FM is definitely much worse than DC as PM. Now I am afraid to go to sleep!

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  6. Why does it have to be elected? Surely a chamber of independently appointed members, chosen for their expertise, would be worth more than duplicating the commons

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    1. Isn't alleged expertise often one of the excuses given for nominations to the HoL now? If it isn't chosen by the public, you just run the risk of cronyism in new appointments.

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    2. There's a job for Mr Kelly or some other.Have a look at different systems of government and do an article on what the alternatives are for an upper chamber and,indeed,to an upper chamber.

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  7. I'm often genuinely surprised by the astoundingly idiotic statements that regularly come out of Kezias mouth. The girls a qualified Lawyer so that would suggest she has a reasonably functional brain although she shows little outward sign of have used it. In the past, I assumed that she was spouting lines written for her Murphy or McTiernan but her recent displays of supreme dumbness appear to be all her own work. Still she was mentored by George Foulkes and then had to work for McT and Murphy. I imagine that would leave anyone with "issues". She's almost like a Scottish Sarah Palin

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    1. "She's almost like a Scottish Sarah Palin."

      Ouch. That's going to leave a mark:
      https://youtu.be/J3Tw9TaM_cQ

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  8. I would love to see the expressions on Lords Reid, Darling, and the rest of the 'Proud Scots but' in the House of Lords, when they read or heard about Dugdale's remarks about Glasgow hosting an elected second chamber. These people went into politics imo for the career and perks that come with being based in London. Dugdale's gaffe is extremely stupid, surely she cannot be this dim?

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  9. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 3, 2015 at 10:35 PM

    I would abolish the EU, the Scottish Parliament, The Welsh and NI Assemblies.
    The Taff's, Joke's and Micks could each have a day in Westminster along with the English. Get rid of the Lords entirely. A small second chanber of legal experts is requried to scrutinise legislation. This great idea from me would save billions of pounds better spent on health and other public services. Looks like the Tartan Tories have caved in to the Calmac workers. Did not expect this from the bastards. But then again they have to keep up the pretence that they are for working people.

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    1. Got the backshift today tough luck.

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    2. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 3, 2015 at 11:35 PM

      Hope it was not too painful. Try lubrication.

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  10. I'm sure the FM will remind Kezia of her comments with glee after the summer break

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  11. James,

    Kez is still struggling to get a single sentence out,without mentioning the SNP.

    She is about as forward-thinking as her last boss and will probably have the same effect on her Party as he did.

    The Lords are a total mess and it is pretty evident that it is not just Scots who think it should be abolished.

    The latest Tory bunch put forward, including the gorgeous Michelle, will do nothing to change that public perception.

    Personally, I would make it a condition that anyone who continuously dribbles, is automatically excluded - that, in itself would remove virtually all the Tories at a single sweep.

    Michelle can stay, though.

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    1. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 1:30 AM

      She is just a youngsster and has a lot to learn moreso about fascists but she has  a bit of time on hand.

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    2. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 10:42 AM

      The Tories out Toried you Nat sis at the budget. Corporation Tax etc. Handing money to the rich. Bunch of fuckin hypocrites overseeing food banks in Scotland.

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    3. That would be the same Tories, whose further Austerity measures those spineless twats in the Labour Party failed to vote against.

      Thank God there were very bright people who switched, in droves, from SLab to SNP and are continuing to do so.

      The only SLab supporters who stayed within the fold, were the dumbest.

      Who the hell would wish to be associated with that bunch of total incompetents and losers?

      Apart from incompetents and losers.

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  12. Michelle ain't that young - but she is certainly going to the right place to learn about fascists.

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  13. Does she have to work hard to be that stupid?

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  14. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 11:02 AM

    Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Upsetting the rich maybe!

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    Replies
    1. (sounds the troll alert)

      Coolheads Prevail

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    2. Glasgow Working Class aka James McGibbon spouts the same pish on many blogs, not just here.

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    3. Ahhhh - that is who he is?



      James McGibbon - On "Left Foot Forward" -


      "2 million people voted for the Union. Not all us Scots are narrowback Nat sis that want to dwell on Wullyum Wallace. The Nat sis have shown they have no respect for democracy and the will of the people."


      Same descriptives and same drivel there, as on here.



      So - Glasgow Working Class is actually James McGibbon.


      Welcome to this site, James.


      Why so shy?

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    4. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 3:11 PM

      Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Upsetting the rich maybe!

      Delete
  15. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 3:13 PM

    Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Upsetting the rich maybe!

    ReplyDelete
  16. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 3:16 PM

    Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Upsetting the rich maybe!

    ReplyDelete
  17. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 3:38 PM

    Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Upsetting the rich maybe!

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  18. James, you seem to be attracting the attention and efforts of a number of troll creatures these days. You must be doing something right. Keep up the good work!

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    Replies
    1. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 4:08 PM

      Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Upsetting the rich maybe!

      Delete
  19. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 4:23 PM

    Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Improve mental health care!

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  20. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 4:53 PM

    Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Improve mental health care!

    ReplyDelete
  21. James ( Kelly)


    McGibbon/GWC is now spamming the board/ multi-posting.

    Put the poor, beaten, wee troll out his misery and just kick him off.

    He is only a waste of space on here.

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    Replies
    1. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 5:20 PM

      Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Improve mental health care!

      Delete
    2. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 5:21 PM

      Why does the Nat sis not use the powers they have James? Improve mental health care!

      Delete
    3. I agree with David Francis. Nigerian princes and Viagra-selling spammers add more to discussions than this GWC numpty does. Gie's peace!

      Another David

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  22. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 5:24 PM

    mental health care! mental health care! mental health care! Improve mental health care!

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    Replies
    1. Call the nurse if you need help.

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    2. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 4, 2015 at 5:42 PM

      Nurses is all Nat sis nurses

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  23. Did I misremember you asking what to do about trolls? Is it impossible to get rid of them? They are totally screwing up the comments section now. Hardly worth reading, it's either your resident troll or people feeding him.

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    1. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 1:38 AM

      Leach is a good name kind of like repugnant and the worse Scotland has to offer the human race.

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  24. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 12:27 AM

    James you do have some strange characters posting on your blog. At least you should have the integrity to expose them as you know who is the real Glasgow Working Class. Sad bunch you Nat sis. You will be exposed for what you are..Sad for Scotland.

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  25. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 12:43 AM

    James I know the SNP have never been fans of the trade unions and working class in general. Are you happy that the Cal Mac workers have been given an offer protecting their terms and conditions or would you prefer the EU had had their way in driving down salaries and working conditions.

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  26. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 1:39 AM

    FEED ME!!!

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  27. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 1:42 AM

    FEED ME!!!

    ReplyDelete
  28. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 1:58 AM

    James, if you had integrity you'll make them stop it. Just stop it, Nat sis. Who are you? Stop it, I know what you doing Nat sis.

    It's dark outside, stop it make it go away, why are the trees tower over me, stop it,

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  29. James, is there any value in porting your blog from Blogger to Wordpress? Maybe that will give you more granular control and you can weed out the spammers.

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  30. First time I have see a Troll being Trolled - maybe.

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    Replies
    1. Glasgow Working ClassAugust 5, 2015 at 12:49 PM

      FEED ME!!!

      Delete
    2. ...

      Coolheads Prevail

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